Roundup: Why both sides are right (or wrong) in the 'Zero Dark Thirty' debate
Also: NYT Oscar ballots, and how many votes do you need for a nomination?
"Zero Dark Thirty"
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I know, I know, more column inches on the "Zero Dark Thirty" torture debate. But I'm leading with Andrew O'Hehir's piece because it's the most thoughtful, level-headed response I've read on the matter so far. He's a fan of the film -- most flatteringly, he compares it to the "complex historical fiction" of Dickens or Tolstoy --, but doesn't see that as any reason to assume it takes the morally "right" position. "Both interpretations can be simultaneously correct," he writes, "partly because it’s an unusually complicated work, partly because there are so many things we don’t know about the Bush administration’s notorious “detainee program,” and partly because art is an inherently amoral and ruthless enterprise, however much we may want to believe otherwise." Great stuff. [Salon]
A.O. Scott, Manohla Dargis and Stephen Holden post their annual ideal Oscar ballots. Among their points of agreement: "Amour" (plus its two leads) and "Zero Dark Thirty." Props for including Matthias Schoenaerts, Ms. Dargis, but he is not supporting. [New York Times]
Steve Pond crunches the numbers on the Academy's various voting branches -- reaching, among others, the conclusion that you only need 36 votes to nab a nomination from the cinematographers' branch. In case 36 of them are reading: Robbie Ryan for "Wuthering Heights," please. [The Wrap]
Anthony Breznican, who's settling nicely into his role as EW's chief Oscar columnist, wishes he'd championed "Compliance" hopeful Ann Dowd harder through the season. [Entertainment Weekly]
Jon Weisman considers the voters scrambling to see everything in time for the Academy's January 3 deadline, and joins many in asking: why the rush, Oscar? [Variety]
Anne Hathaway talks to Amy Kaufman about her career ambitions, and performing over 20 takes -- at her insistence, not Tom Hooper's -- of "I Dreamed a Dream." [LA Times]
Adrian Curry's typically considered list of the year's best movie posters has some picks you definitely won't see coming. [MUBI]
Oscar-nominated costume designer Julie Weiss chats to Nathaniel Rogers about clothing the on- and offscreen worlds of "Hitchcock." [The Film Experience]
Jackson Truax talks to Janusz Kaminski about his longstanding collaboration with Steven Spielberg and, more specifically, his work in "Lincoln." [Awards Daily]
Ronald Bergan remembers Harry Carey Jr., the western-inclined character actor best known for his multiple collaborations with John Ford, who passed away recently aged 91. [The Guardian]
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Login or create a HitFix account Login SignupLiz Norris
December 31, 2012 at 10:11AM EST Reply to CommentThose NYT ballots have some very weird categorizations. Matthais Schoenaerts, Rosemarie DeWitt, Hugh Grant, Shlomo Bar Aba, and Kara Hayward are all pretty clearly leads (and that's not even including usual suspects Philip Seymour Hoffman and Helen Hunt). Also, did anyone else think that Charlize Theron was actually kind of terrible in "Snow White and the Huntsman"? I usually adore her, but that whole performance just made me cringe.
Prettok The NYT article annoys me. Dont these guys have their own movie awards? How would Scott, Dargis and Holden feel if AMPAS wrote an article telling the NY Film Critics Society who they should honor?
December 31, 2012 at 8:51PM ESTGuy Lodge Liz: Yeah, I also think Theron is weirdly off her game there -- and in a role she really ought to be relishing.
January 1, 2013 at 9:14PM ESTPrettok: I'm pretty sure they wouldn't mind at all, and would proceed to do exactly as they please -- just like Academy voters. Isn't the internet awash with Oscar wishlist articles? (We do them every year, after all.) Why do you take such issue with this one? Such pieces only credit the awards' pop-cultural standing.
prettok I know they do it every year, but this was the first time it struck me as somewhat presumptious. How would you react if K. Tapley wrote an article titled "What I think Guy Lodge's top ten list should be."
January 2, 2013 at 12:20AM ESTAlso the Oscars are industry awards. These folks have different standards in judging movies than critics. They Oscar doesn't go to the 'best' picture of the year. (if there is ever such a thing as a purely objective 'best picture') It goes to the showcase picture, the movie that Hollywood thinks best represents itself.
Tausif Khan
December 31, 2012 at 11:51AM EST Reply to Comment" the Bush administration’s notorious “detainee program,” "
If this is in the original article it is a factual inaccuracy as the film takes place during the Obama administration and is therefore the Obama administration's detainee/torture policy. What would be slightly more accurate is calling it the Bush/Obama detainee torture policy as few policies have changed in between the administrations and the continuity of which gives a greater understanding of how the global policies of the last ten years led to the the events of May 1, 2011
RichardZ
December 31, 2012 at 11:52AM EST Reply to Comment"Interesting" choices from Ms. Dargis. I get that she's rooting for "Footnote" which I admire. But, Bar Aba? Lior Ashkenazi was the one I was expecting to get some notice. The screenplay is truly outstanding and fearless.
RichardZ FYI, Footnote was nominated for Best Foreign Film last year. Ms. Dargis's "Oscar Issue, And The Nominees Should Be" is a bit late for Footnote.
December 31, 2012 at 11:57AM ESTGuy Lodge While it's true that Footnote's nomination last year disqualifies it from other categories this year, surely "And the nominees should be" can also imply that such arcane eligibility rules shouldn't be in existence.
January 1, 2013 at 9:18PM ESTcineJAB
December 31, 2012 at 12:28PM EST Reply to Commentcan i assume that shot used in the picture above is in the discussion for the best shots of the year? I know it's still a while till that gets posted, but that image absolutely stuck with me.
Mayukh
December 31, 2012 at 2:58PM EST Reply to CommentThe classification of Kara Hayward as supporting is also quite disconcerting...
FistOSalmon
December 31, 2012 at 10:29PM EST Reply to CommentYeah both sides aren't simultaneously right and wrong.
I haven't seen Zero Dark Thirty since it's not in wide release yet, but people that have and are reporting on it are saying that it depicts the information obtained from enhanced interrogation techniques (or torture depending on your position) as leading directly to the capture of Bin Laden. This has been denied by every piece of testimony given and every statement made by every official and off the record source. At best there have been very few and no confirmed reports that information obtained under these techniques were used to additionally confirm intelligence that had previously been collected and verified. There is a difference between taking legitimate artistic license and flatly misrepresenting facts to "punch up" a story.
There's also a big difference between altering events and facts to an event from sixty years ago to streamline a narrative, express a thematic idea or add dimension to characters that are an amalgamation of historical individuals and applying the same storytelling techniques to people that are not only still living, but still active in the same careers and still under the statute of legality for potentially illegal acts.
So yes, the depiction of tortue techniques leading to the killing of OBL in Zero Dark Thirty against all factual information in a time when those policies are being actively debated and civil cases against the government and past and present members of it are still being adjudicated IS irresponsible filmmaking.
I'll see it when it comes out and as everyone should make my own decision based on the film itself but the headline "Roundup: Why both sides are right (or wrong) in the 'Zero Dark Thirty' debate." is unfortunate and biased. At the least it should have been attributed to the writer of original article.
On a personal note I'd not recommend the article itself, it's a little too much in the Beltway false equivalency bipartisanship vein that's more about punching hippies to offset conservative claims of media bias than an honest look at issues but whatever.
Maddy
January 2, 2013 at 3:34AM EST Reply to Commentthat article's claim of ZDT not having a clear hero to root for is hilarious considering kris just named "maya" as the year's best hero. lol. if that was the point of the movie, then it clearly didn't go through for most people.