Inside Television with Alan Sepinwall

‹

›

'Homeland' - 'Achilles Heel': The good wives

Review: 'The Walking Dead' - 'Secrets': Target practice

Rick and Lori have a talk, and Shane teaches Andrea how to shoot

By Alan SepinwallSunday, Nov 20, 2011 10:00 PM

Shane (Jon Bernthal) teaches Andrea (Laurie Holden) how to shoot on "The Walking Dead."

Credit: AMC

Are you a fan of The Walking Dead?

Sign up to get the latest updates instantly.

A quick review of tonight's "The Walking Dead" coming up just as soon as I buy your silence with fruit and jerky...

The good part first: Lori confesses her affair with Shane to Rick, and Rick is unsurprised and largely unphased. I know it's only been about 10 episodes since the two of them were reunited, and that many shows might drag out this kind of revelation over many more episodes, but when you spread them out over two seasons, and when you spend so much time on Lori's guilt and paranoia about the affair coming to light, it was well past time to stop keeping it a secret. I liked that Rick had either figured it out in the back of his mind, or else was able to do the math very quickly and accept it; there are plenty of times where the demands of the plot make Rick and his people out to be idiots, so it was a relief to have a moment where he understands something instantly, and if he's not terribly happy about it, he gets it.

On the other hand, putting their debate about abortion(*) only a couple of episodes after Rick and Lori had essentially the same argument about whether to keep trying to save Carl's life added to the sense that so much of season 2 so far has been wheel-spinning. The gang found refuge at Hershel's farm, and they repeat various conflicts over and over during this relatively peaceful time, and while this lull may be setting us up for whatever bad thing happens next - either with the zombies in the barn or simply Hershel kicking them out of paradise - the show needs a kick in the ass, and soon. They're starting to do some interesting things with some of the characters - Andrea becomes an effective, if bloodthirsty, gunslinger, Dale finally confronts Shane about his behavior (albeit possibly out of jealousy that Shane has hooked up with Andrea) and Maggie points out that Glen is much more awesome than he or the group realizes - but it's happening verrry slowly, as if the plot was itself a walker, shuffling along until it gets to whatever destination offers food next.

(*) And let me remind you once again, very strongly, that this blog is a No Politics zone. We are not going to actually debate the morality of abortion, in either the world we know or the one Rick and Lori are trapped in. Period. Any comment that heads down that road gets deleted. Got me?

We're almost done with the first half of the season, then we get a break until February. We're also fairly close, I think, to the point where Frank Darabont left, for reasons unknown. He helped break the entire season's arc with Glen Mazzara and the rest of the writers who stuck around, so I don't imagine we're going to see a radical shift in the back half of the season. But as we get ready to say goodbye to the show for a couple of months, I'm beginning to wonder if Darabont's exit might not turn out to be a blessing in disguise. Darabont's a terrific writer and director. You can look at his movies, or even this show's pilot, to see that. But the storytelling was uneven for the rest of the first season, and something's definitely been lacking in these early season 2 episodes. Mazzara's not going to re-invent the show from scratch, at least not this year (his imprint will probably be more keenly felt in season 3), but maybe a different voice from the head man add a little juice to the back half of the season.

Before we go to the comments, let me remind you once again about the no spoilers rules for this blog, and specifically how it relates to a show like this adapted from a popular source material:

1)No Spoilers.

2)This includes any discussion of the previews for the next episode.

3)This includes any discussion of storylines from the comic that haven't happened yet in the timeline of the TV show. (And, yes, the show has and will continue to deviate from the comic in some ways, but for the sake of those instances where they're going to be the same, I don't want people talking about something from issue 50 when we're watching episode 11.)

4)This includes anything you've seen or read elsewhere about anything that has not happened within the context of the episodes that have already aired.

Got that? Now what did everybody else think? Are you disappointed the show's about to take a break, or are you ready to take one yourselves?

Alan Sepinwall
Sr. Editor, What's Alan Watching

Alan Sepinwall has been reviewing television since the mid-'90s, first for Tony Soprano's hometown paper, The Star-Ledger, and now for HitFix. His new book, "The Revolution Was Televised," about the last 15 years of TV drama, is for sale at Amazon. He can be reached at sepinwall@hitfix.com

Alan Sepinwall Recaps & Reviews

View By Show »

Next 213 Comments

John

I only watch a limited number of shows, but I can't imagine there are any worse characters on any show than Andrea and Dale. Horribly written, horribly acted, no redeeming or interesting qualities at all.
November 20, 2011 at 11:05PM EST Reply to Comment
- Other John The son in Terra Nova. Worst character on tv now.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:11AM EST
- Ian I pretty much agree. But then again, I pretty much hate EVERY character on this show.
  
  I'd be very happy if everyone but Daryl died. I could watch a show where each week Daryl will just wander around through the woods and kill zombies. It would be a massive improvement over this hot mess.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:22AM EST
- I've decided that darryl needs to fall through a wormhole with a few walkers and let them wipe out Terra Nova so that we can have what will surely win the Oscar for beat show ever: Daryl Dixon and Commander Taylor do stuff.
  
  Your welcome for that idea (that I partially ripped off)
  November 21, 2011 at 2:52AM EST
- James @CORY: Oscars are for movies, not tv shows
  November 21, 2011 at 12:49PM EST
- Jack I'm only responding to this because I like the idea of a debate about the worst character TV show character. Taco, from "The League", gets my vote.
  November 21, 2011 at 4:28PM EST
- Dave I I like Dale & Andrea. Dale is at least observant and Andrea at least shows character growth. Of course, I'm biased because I like their characters in the books, so it's hard to know if I like them because of the show incarnations or not.
  
  For worst characters on a TV show? I'd vote Gabe from The Office, except for the Lost characters Lennon, Dogen, and fan favorites (to make fun of) Nikki & Paulo.
  November 22, 2011 at 5:33PM EST
- LMFAOSHMSFOAIDMT (laughing my effin arse off so hard that my sombrero fell off and I dropped my taco) @ James. It was sarcasm and a talladega nights reference :P
  November 22, 2011 at 9:53PM EST
- Wylie76 Oh please, nobody comes close to Tara on True Blood in terms of annoying characters.
  November 23, 2011 at 4:37PM EST
- I agree: Tara from True Blood is absolutely terrible (and one of the main reasons I stopped watching that show).
  Ben from LOST helped ruin that show, but Daniel the scientist on LOST was possibly the worst character on any t.v. show ever ("ummm....you see, it's like a vortex that can...I don't know...do things"). Michelle Rodriguez's acting on LOST was horrible.
  And Ted from How I met your Mother is without a doubt the worst miscast ever.
  So my list is (in no particular order):
  Tara, Ben, Daniel, Ted, Connor (from "Angel"), Dawn (Buffy)
  November 24, 2011 at 3:03PM EST
- ZDT I agree, and what's really sad is that Andrea and Dale are two of my favorites in the comics. Andrea is very strong and a leader of the group there, versus whatever she is in the show...certainly not that.
  November 26, 2011 at 12:45PM EST
Stef

I enjoy character development, but it feels like it's about time for something to HAPPEN already. They need to leave Hershel's farm, they are definitely growing too complacent. A show about the zombie apocalypse shouldn't become a relationship drama on the farm, they need to get them back out into the context of the rest of the world.
November 20, 2011 at 11:05PM EST Reply to Comment
- renee Reply to comment...i agree!
  November 20, 2011 at 11:35PM EST
- Duane Reply to comment...i completely agree!!
  November 20, 2011 at 11:43PM EST
- ron mexico What I've been thinking about in the context of what's happened to the show from AMC's management budget cuts is how that's impacted the storytelling in the show. It's been well known that the budget has been cut from the per episode average from the first season to this season - when the norm is to actually increase, especially for shows as successful as TWD. I have to think that there's some kind of impact to the storytelling. Could it be that the general lack of action / lack of movement be somewhat due to the restricted budget?
  November 21, 2011 at 12:04AM EST
- Who can say really? What I can say though, is that not a single episode has been as good or captured the tension (incredible use of silence where u go?) As well as ssn 1. I'm pretty sure I'm done with the show unless there are some huge surprises next week. I know there won't be however bc the writers are absolutely horrible with mystery or intrigue. Too bad they think this is Zost
  November 21, 2011 at 2:56AM EST
- GarySF What's Zost?
  November 21, 2011 at 10:46AM EST
- Mark in Omaha Taking a guess that it's Lost with Zombies.
  November 21, 2011 at 11:32AM EST
- +1 for Mark :D
  November 22, 2011 at 9:54PM EST
Bill

I still enjoy the show but not as much as season one. I liked it for the action and this season is lacking in that department. How do you think Dale knew they hooked up?
November 20, 2011 at 11:08PM EST Reply to Comment
- consideract Dale was just paying attention, which is probably what I appreciate most about his character. Andrea's smile, the glances and looking away, the hesitations, click click click, figures it out. Just paying attention.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:28AM EST
- JB I'm pretty sure there were hicky marks on Andrea's neck as well - a clear indication that something happened with Shane. Dale isn't stupid; he figured it out.
  November 21, 2011 at 10:52AM EST
- I don't know how Dale knew, but I really wish Shane would shoot him in the face. Dale (and that idiot farmer) are just bad characters: in this apocalyptic world, it's highly unlikely that such moralizing idiots would have any power or voice over anyone. The farmer would just get killed for his home and Dale would get beaten by any one who was just sick of hearing from him. There are no more rules in this world...what keeps these people from just doing what they want? The morality of humans is based on contemporary cultural values,and these values change (sometimes drastically) when the environment changes. Rick and his annoying wife, the farmer, Dale...they wouldn't last long with the peity they ooze.
  November 24, 2011 at 3:08PM EST
ron mexico

Boy, that walker in the pharmacy really came out of nowhere...after many eventless runs, finally Maggie runs into a walker, though i found her reaction a little surprising, as if she'd never seen a walker before.

Are we supposed to think of Shane as a "bad guy?" With him drawing on Rick, and his killing of Otis, it feels like he's supposed to be a "bad guy" though isn't it arguable that his killing of Otis was a hard, but justifiable decision (it seemed like they were trying to paint the situation as desperate - that both men were exhausted and would die without Shane making the "hard decision")? Is there room to interpret Shane as a emotionally disturbed, but still decent person who is more willing to compromise traditional morality to survive while Rick remains an idealist?

I think a part of me really wants to like Shane, because he's way more interesting than Rick, but it'd be hard to self-justify liking his character as much if he was truly a "bad guy." He also provides a lot of needed counterbalance to the show - most of the characters just seem too "nice" - even everyone's favorite crossbow-armed racist has been Sipowicz'd - his hard edges filed down to be more palatable, but less dramatically interesting.

November 20, 2011 at 11:09PM EST Reply to Comment
- Eamon What Shane did may well have been necessary, but we can't say that for certain. He might have been able to escape from that situation through some other means, which makes his actions very difficult to justify. As to your comment about Daryl, I agree that they've changed him significantly and made him more audience friendly, but I don't think it's come at the expense of him being dramatically interesting. Did you find the Daryl character interesting last year? I don't really remember what I thought of him throughout the first season, which leads me to suspect I didn't find him all that captivating.
  November 20, 2011 at 11:24PM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose I thought the pharmacy scene was badly set up. Was the walker sleeping and woke up? How did Maggie not get bit? As with the previous visit & having seen Rick's horse devoured way back in I think the second episode it, ahem, nags at me that they have those poor horses tied up outside like a couple of steaks on the Bar-B waiting for random diners to happen by.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:15AM EST
- Paradox When Shane shot Otis, it could be seen as a complex moral issue. In this episode when he talks to Dale, Shane does come off as more a straight-up "bad guy" as you say.
  Now I'm not sure if Shane is a good complex character, or if the people in charge are just mishandling him and he's winding up an interesting character by accident. He IS interesting (to me), but maybe a little too inconsistent.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:22AM EST
- consideract I have very strong views about Shane being a bad guy. There's no question to me, and I can understand Shane himself dancing justifications in his head, but he's bad and his sacrificing Otis was just wrong, and destructive to his own character. Like anyone, however, that doesn't make him any less complex, nor incapable of good. The way the Otis scene was written was not a complex moral issue, and. I am more offended, I suppose, as a writer. The complexity of that moment is not about new zombie realities; it's about the kind of choice that changes you or seals your fate or sets you off down a terrible road.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:46AM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose @consideract: Interesting, I saw it somewhat differently, maybe very differently. I thought the director made it clear in building Shane's perception as being that together neither one would make it. He'd tried the noble gesture (perhaps not fully honest with himself about whether he really would have accepted Otis's going on without him) and at this point decided it was going to be him and not Otis. That Otis didn't have the stones to make this choice, that overall he was a better asset to his group than was Otis, and that Otis was so out of shape that he might not make it on his own - these are consequentialist rationizations to be sure, but they also happen to be true, or high probability. One thing that distopic situations like this show or say Battlestar Galactica do is set up an environment in which duty/intentions-based ethical systems seem more problematic.
  November 21, 2011 at 2:53AM EST
- Yes, shane has become a one dimensional, poorly written bad guy. You know bc a zombie apocalypse and a mentally unbalanced hershel don't present enough danger...
  
  This show has become an excercise in missed opportunities. The tension between him and rick would have been so much better, not to mention justified, had it started once they found out Lori was pregnant. I are disapoint. So disapoint
  November 21, 2011 at 3:00AM EST
- Alex T. Agree with Cory, here. Shane definitely had a lot of potential, especially compared to every other character in the show, as far as character development, and I think the writers blew it now...he is starting to be one dimensional.
  November 21, 2011 at 8:28AM EST
- consideract @Anon - Yes, I think even perhaps the producers/directors/writer wanted to convey at least some measure of that idea of Shane making a hard choice in a cruel world, and I appreciate the potential of such. That is why perhaps I am more offended by the writing than by Shane's actions. They may want the ambiguity, in the sense they want us to argue about such hard choices, but to argue about hard choices means it has to be a really hard choice, and I really don't see that it was, as Eamon points out above. I simply don't buy the scene as Shane having no choice. If he actually had no choice, that would be a different conversation. I also personally think Otis had more stones than perhaps Shane ever will. Part of the evil in Shane's actions are his "consequentist rationalizations," his ego saying he is the real survivor, the one who is going to survive. I think this aspect of Shane is highlighted by something he says in the previews for next week, but we have to wait until next week to discuss that. (Meta-irony: from what people say, his character in the comics was one of the first to go, long before now.) At that particular moment, Otis was in better shape than an injured Shane; by that rationalization, he should have tossed his bag to Otis and sacrificed himself. *That* would have been an example of a hard choice. I am a fan of the ancient art of dilemmas (see the Greeks). I love them in writ in, television and otherwise. That is probably one reason I get so passionate about this fake wannabe version of such a moment. To me, Shane's arc, highlighted by this moment, reads as a man claiming to himself that he makes hard decisions, so that he can actually take the easy way out. The mantra "I make the hard decisions" is a cop-out. Shane is at best an aspiring Col. Jessep (Jack Nicholson's brittle, revelatory, "You can't handle the truth.") He is not, by way of contrast, a Dirty Harry type of character, though he may think he is.
  November 21, 2011 at 9:21AM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose @consideract: I guess I just accept the premise that his character would not have made that choice if he didn't believe that it was either him or Otis. And so I'm unwilling to agree that we are being presented with a false view of his choice unless we learn something more in a later flashback. Not because Shane's noble, but because it was problematic for him to return alone and he was clearly distressed when he shot Otis. So I accept that it was from necessity married with ego on his part as the show intends us to understand. What makes this a harder moral eval for us as the Greek chorus is that I believe Shane is correct that in the long run (after his injuries heal) he is more likely to be an asset than is Otis, especially with respect to his own group generally and the boy in particular. But as Aristotle said, our choices make us who we are and having made such a choice Shane is a damaged person. And yet a damaged person may just be what the doctor ordered for surviving an apocalypse.
  Nice disagreeing with you. Regards - Anon Z
  November 21, 2011 at 11:57AM EST
- FINSBURY Shane is one of the "good" characters on the show, although he could be written better. Shane is living by his own moral code, in a pronounced way. That makes Shane one of the more interesting characters. Shane is conflicted between being out for himself (which allows him to put Rick in his sights and sacrafice Otis) and wanting to protect Carl (which is self serving to an extent)which requires Shane to live by Rick/the group/society's rules.
  
  The show would be better if each character had a more individual moral code. Instead, we have the Rick version, now the Hershel version, and the Daryl version (which is similar to Rick's, but stripped down to survival first).
  November 21, 2011 at 12:16PM EST
- houseofjenny Don't forget the obvious, too...Shane wants very badly to live. Not only to help keep Lori and Carl safe, not only because he knows what an asset he is to this or any other group. He's a survivor, a man who thinks he has what it takes to make the 'hard' decisions that will ultimately allow him to keep moving forward.
  
  And this doesn't make me hate him at all. In fact, this makes him more real to me. He's not so far into the living vs. walker world that he hasn't forgotten the rules of the dog-eat-dog world.
  November 21, 2011 at 5:49PM EST
- marrymedaryl hm... i think it was harsh to let otis be ripped apart while still alive (couldn't he have been shot in the head to be dead before the walkers devoured him?), i don't completely hate shane for sacrifiicing him. in fact, shane is really growing on me. i liked the whole sequence with him and andrea: from his gun training to her getting upset when he mentioned amy, to their expedition to the walker neighbourhood and even the quickie int he car: i like them as a couple. she's definitely more up his street than bawling lori (god, i hate her)
  November 22, 2011 at 4:57AM EST
- consideract @Anon - yes, we will just have to disagree. It may perhaps be that you are right that *Shane* thought it was himself or Otis. That would be why I lean toward having more of a problem with the writing. Because that scene is not clear as such a moment. I think it is one more example of writing characters into a situation/action to make the plot go the way the writers want rather than the characters, and that they failed in actually doing it right because they seemingly bought their own plot diagram. I base this a bit on something one of the producers said on Talking Dead. That all aside, I personally think someone like Shane is NOT a real asset in an apocalypse, or keeping it real, the actual hell on earth that already really exists, war. Shane may be an asset for himself, but not for any meaningful survival, which ultimately takes a group. He is in my estimate one of the more dangerous people to the group. At the very least, he has shown he would make a terrible leader. No worries about disagreeing.
  November 22, 2011 at 9:11PM EST
Bill

I'd like more flashbacks to the apocalypse like the opening scene last week too.
November 20, 2011 at 11:10PM EST Reply to Comment
- JimAbbott'sRightHandMan I'd love a good double-episode mostly focusing on the day it all went down. Kind of like the Season Two opener of "The West Wing" where they showed all the White House staffers in the jobs/lives they had before the Bartlet campaign.
  
  If nothing else, it'd be cool to see Merle and Darryl being badasses when the stuff first hit the fan (that'd be some red meat for all the people crying about wanting more action). And see Glenn freak out over it. And all that good stuff.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:53AM EST
- Daryl/Merle would be cool, but with such an obviously hamstrung budget, is rather they focus on the present than having to spend big $$ on vfx
  November 21, 2011 at 3:02AM EST
- JB I'd like more flashbacks, too - kind of in the style of "LOST", where the flashbacks would set the scene for something that was about to go down in that episode. Or to find out more about the backstory of each character.
  November 21, 2011 at 10:55AM EST
- Oh god, please no more attempts to Lostify the show. Lost was very well executed and 90% of shows these days bumble their attempts to mimic it.
  November 22, 2011 at 9:56PM EST
George

Did Dale say that Carl stole the gun under the pretense of borrowing a walkie talkie? I wasn't sure if I heard that right because I definitely think there have been some times when walkie-talkies would have come in handy for this group.
November 20, 2011 at 11:13PM EST Reply to Comment
- Chimpotle As far as I know, Rick only uses the walkie to try and check in with the guy and his son who helped in Season 1. Makes perfect sense to send Carl to get it for his dad.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:31AM EST
GarySF

Worst. Episode. Yet. Let’s see…

Laurie sends Glen and the farmgirl to town for abortion pills, nearly getting them killed, only to change her mind after taking them? And how careless could she be, leaving the packaging laying around for Rick to find.

Shane uses his hot new ride, and the excuse of finding poor Sofia, as a ruse to get down with Andrea? Then they both report to Carol that they had no luck, and nearly smile when they say the place was overrun? And Carol’s only reaction is “let’s go get you cleaned up.” Uh, Andrea’s a big girl, I’m sure she’s capable of cleaning herself up.

That Andrea’s none to subtle when she wants to get some, is she? Going straight for the spot? I think every group of survivors needs some women like that.
Can Herschel and, by extension, his whole family, be so disconnected and naïve to think that they can cure their loved ones and neighbors in the barn? Did this farm have no TV or radio as the apocalypse occurred?

And boy, that feeding frenzy with the chickens sure causes a ruckus…did no one in Rick’s crew hear that since they’ve been on the farm?

They all feel way to safe on this farm. Shooting practice, really? They already know walkers are attracted by sounds. Nothing subtle about a bunch of gunshots.

Still quite a bit of supplies left in the pharmacy in town, including…drugs! How helpful that the essential items for survival and comfort haven’t been completely cleaned out.

There was only one reasonably good scene, when Dale called out Shane on his behavior and his account of Otis’ death. Then Shane makes a threat, but turns around and walks away. Dale’s idiotic face of fear was poor acting from one of the show’s more solid actors.

Speaking of Dale, he has no more “guile” than Glen. His excuse to Herschel about wandering near the barn was about as lame as his forced observation to Laurie to acknowledge that he knows she’s pregnant. This guy – or more precisely, the writers – need to try a different tact.

And speaking of secrets, could Laurie seriously think her pregnancy wouldn’t get out, after sending Glen into town not once, but twice to get pregnancy-related stuff. This is a small group. Word spreads fast, even if Glen doesn't blab.

When exactly did Shane become a deep-south hick?

Overall, lots of soap opera, zero character development, and, again, almost no plot movement. We’re still at the farm, Herschel wants them to go, and the group wants to stay. Sofia’s still lost, Carol’s still useless, Yay. I’m watching out of habit now, and because there’s just one more episode until the season break.

November 20, 2011 at 11:16PM EST Reply to Comment
- Mikepdoyle Great post. I feel the same way.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:04AM EST
- Lee Yes, I also wondered what happened to the "rule" of not shooting guns, lest the walkers be attracted by the noise. Yet there they all were, blasting away! Also, is there an unlimited supply of ammunition that they can afford to waste bullets like that? Is there also an unlimited supply of food so that whoever-she-is could break the legs of live chickens and feed them to the walkers? And why do the walkers need to be fed, anyway? They're dead, aren't they? Will they die again of starvation if they don't eat? It seems like the writers don't care if the stories make sense anymore.
  November 21, 2011 at 3:30AM EST
- Eldritch
  "And why do the walkers need to be fed, anyway? "
  
  Exactly my question.
  
  Why do they need to eat?
  
  And exactly why do their legs need to be broken? They can't catch chickens trapped in a barn with them?
  
  And my bonus question is, do zombies share chickens equally with one another?
  November 21, 2011 at 5:55AM EST
- Maggie Q Agree about the pharmacy. The shelves look almost completely bare, but on a bottom shelf Glen found one pregnancy kit? And did Lori ask for the pills by brand name? Glen didn't seem to know what they were until Maggie figured it out and told him.
  
  I also don't get why they keep going back to the phramacy for one or two things - it's not like the corner bodega. Why not just sweep all the bottles of meds from the shelves into a trash bag and haul them back to the farm? Hard to believe at this point they still feel they need to only take what they need and leave the rest for other survivors to access.
  November 21, 2011 at 8:08AM EST
- Matt As to why they were allowed to shoot guns, I thought that's why they drove away from the farm, to make sure they didn't attract any walkers there. It's still a risk, but one they've deemed necessary to ensure their group is able to protect themselves.
  
  I think the chickens' legs were broken so that they couldn't hop up to the rafters in the barn and avoid being eaten.
  
  Just because Herschel's family feeds the walkers, doesn't mean that the show is now saying walkers need food to survive. Herschel's family still (delusionally) views the walkers as real people, and thus, of course real people would need sustenance.
  November 21, 2011 at 10:16AM EST
- Hollywoodaholic Exactly. And if Walkers can eat chickens, why do they need humans? Or Brraaaaiiinnnnnss? At this point they're really not much different than us and should just hang out in a cow pasture munching fresh beef. (We prefer it dead and tasteless, of course)
  November 21, 2011 at 5:22PM EST
- Jim Maggie Q - And did Lori ask for the pills by brand name?
  
  I laughed out loud when I backed up the TIVO to see that the pills were labeled.....wait for it.....Morning After Pills. As if this was the drug name from the manufacturer.
  November 21, 2011 at 5:42PM EST
- LisaMc As far as the walkers "needing" to eat, remember the walker Darryl and Andrea found hanging in the tree? Other walkers had eaten his legs. If nothing else, Hershel et al. may be using the chickens to keep their barn residents relatively whole.
  November 23, 2011 at 7:36AM EST
Rose

As a viewer, Glen in my hero--he moves the plot along. When he goes to town (two episodes ago), we find out that Lori is pregnant. When he tried to arrange a tryst, he finds zombies in the barn. In this episode in less than 30 seconds, he tells Dale of two major secrets. This immediately gives the other characters something to talk or argue about. can we send Glen out to look for Sophia? I have a feeling that once Glen is on the case, we won't have to worry about her fate. Maggie is right--Glen is awsome.
November 20, 2011 at 11:16PM EST Reply to Comment
- comfy chair yes please!
  November 21, 2011 at 2:32AM EST
- consideract Yes, I hope Glen gets a chance to grow and make a difference here. I loved his comment to Lori about maybe she might not want to make such a decision by herself.
  November 21, 2011 at 11:56AM EST
- Lee I was also amused that Maggie got indignant when Glen called the barn residents "walkers", as if it was a racial slur. I half-expected Kramer to show up to accuse Glen of being an "anti-Walkite."
  November 21, 2011 at 12:21PM EST
- FINSBURY I don't think Glen would keep the "walkers in the barn" secret from Rick. not after what he and Rick (and the group) went through starting in Atlanta.
  
  If Glen was conflicted by his feeling for Maggie, that wasn't explained very well.
  
  Glen is a "doer" and I don't see putting a barn full of zombies on the back burner as part of his DNA. He'd tell Rick at the very least.
  
  Glen is one of the best characters and should be featured more.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:24PM EST
- Elevation Being one of the best characters on this show is like being the smartest tree.
  November 21, 2011 at 5:37PM EST
The_NV

As someone who had been largely disappointed with this season to this point, I gotta say I found this episode to be very satisfying. Best episode of the season, so far.
November 20, 2011 at 11:28PM EST Reply to Comment
Andi

I am disappointed the show is taking a break. There are not to many good shows on TV anymore and I really enjoy watching this. The lazy episode was a little slow and needed more zombies. I cannot wait to see the next episode to see if they get out of the barn. People seem to be commenting on the acting but I do not think it is any worse then any other program on cable. Some people look into the show WAY to much I just like to follow the story and be entertained.
November 20, 2011 at 11:31PM EST Reply to Comment
- Not trying to sound condescendimg but there are a ton of incredible, smart, risky shows on tv. Justified, sons of anarchy, community, game of thrones, boardwalk empire, treme, its always sunny. Curb, eastbound and down, chuck, fringe, mad men, breaking bad, more breaking bad, did I mention breaking bad? etc etc etc. I can't think of a si.for season of any of the ones I just named that was as consistently disapointing as this season has been.
  November 21, 2011 at 3:10AM EST
- Joe Corey, you really do seem to spend a lot of time commenting on a show you don't like....
  November 21, 2011 at 10:36AM EST
- Joey, my name is right there and you misspelled it :( I love, absolutely love, season one of this show. Season two is a huge disappointment. Message boards aren't just for singing praises ya know. Discussion of where they are messing up might end up helping them get it back on the right track. Especially considering they have restructured.
  November 22, 2011 at 9:58PM EST
leahblizz

I love criticizing this show. I mean really. I hate it, but pointing out its jillion flaws is pretty fun for me. Where do I even start?

-Zombie apocalypse. And we are wasting how many rounds on shooting practice? Just checking, the forest surrounding you is still full of zombies, right? And, like, they're attracted to noise, right?

-Of course we're going to get the cliche abortion drama. No character on any soap opera can get pregnant without having an episode dedicated to whether or not she's going to get rid of it.

-Andrea is a stupid, emotional disgrace to females. Getting all huffy over bringing up Amy? You see what he's trying to do, right? Motivate you? Lighten up. Good thing you got over it in time to awkwardly grab his crotch.

-The walls to that barn look pretty flimsy. You say zombies are attracted to noise--don't you think the barn zombies would hear the idiots wasting rounds not too far away? I believe they could easily tear out of there. Same for the other way around--you're telling me none of the survivors heard The Great Chicken Massacre?

-Now we're in the phase where nothing's happening, therefore all the characters are coupling up. Shane with Andrea, Carol with Darryl (which is a total bummer, as Darryl's the only likeable character left and they're pairing him off with the female version of Michael from Lost), Glen with whatsherface.

-It really feels like the writers have no plan. I mean, what was accomplished in this episode? Lori had an inner-drama about abortion. Shane and Andrea had sex. I'm thinking that's about it.

If it wasn't so fun to criticize on Twitter I would stop watching it, but it is, so I won't.
November 20, 2011 at 11:34PM EST Reply to Comment
- Fuzzbrain Lori is worried about a newborn baby crying, but they're blowing away cans like it's a shooting gallery at a state fair?! LOL
  November 20, 2011 at 11:44PM EST
- Chris Couldn't agree more. As someone who still hate-watches the Real World, I think the characters in that show are more likable than this Walking Dead cast. Still, hate-watching, regardless of the show, is always fun.
  
  I'll add one more to your list:
  
  -Shane and Andrew go to a residential neighborhood check ONE house, and then call it quits and assume Sophia is nowhere to be found? Is there a reason to believe she isn't next door? Or next door to that? Also, is this the ONLY residential neighborhood Sophia could be in? There's how many houses around Atlanta? But she is only in this one?
  
  -While we're at it, how many times do they make matters harder for themselves. They could have easily got into the car in that neighborhood and driven away, just as Shane and Otis could have easily run away without getting caught and having to shoot anyone at all.
  
  Such a frustrating show. Can't wait to complain about it some more next week.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:08AM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose For me the biggest flaw is the very film-making premise that you're going to make a seasons long Zombie show. Inevitably you'll have to have some down time. After all, an attack after attack after attack show wouldn't work either. And the discussions of the the existence of God/the problem of evil, abortion in zombie-land, whether an ethics of conviction is out the window when consequences weigh so paramount (aka Shane: to blame or not to blame): these are not just fillers, they are quite realistic in the world we've imagined here. In most zombie movies there's no time for them. But these are discussions that are easy to do but hard to do well. It looks like the consensus here is about a C- at best.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:25AM EST
- JANES And how about some zombie consistency? Are they fast? Slow? How do these people keep getting ambushed by mobs of slow-moving undead? Shane/Andrea drive into a deserted neighborhood, walk into a house, and moments later are surrounded by them. Guess they are ninja zombies. This show is so damn slow now - it's just a soap-opera that happens to have zombies in it. Like Pride and Prejudice and Zombies, but not funny.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:11AM EST
- Col Bat Guano Yeah, how did that zombie manage to sneak up on them in the pharmacy? Why doesn't Glen have a gun? Why do they insist on taking horses when there are plenty of guns around? Why haven't they cleaned out the pharmacy so they don't have to keep going back?
  
  For my sanity, can Lori please get bitten in the next episode. I thought Andrea was the most annoying character on the show, but Lori has her beat by a country mile after this hot mess.
  November 21, 2011 at 2:27AM EST
- FISNBURY Hershel's Farm = UTOPIA
  
  My biggest problem with the current plot is the writer's didn't do a good enough job of explaining why Hershel's farm is so safe.
  
  The farm is close to the highway. Yes, they had to drive to get to the farm, but the group walked from the highway to both where Carl was shot by Otis (Rick then ran to the farm) and where Maggie on horseback found the group. So the farm isn't that far from the highway where at least one herd of zombies roamed through.
  
  By not establishing why the farm is so safe, we have basic rules being violated without explaination - gun shots, the generator not attracting zombies, the lights not attracting zombies, etc...
  
  But worse, the complacency of the group "getting comforatable" at the farm (as Lori described) really wasn't set up well. I understood the characters were afforded a break from being on the road, but until Lori described how comfortable everyone was, I didn't see the farm as the Utopia she described and as it must be given the other inconsistencies with the "rules".
  November 21, 2011 at 12:32PM EST
- Froide How come no zombies attacked Maggie and Glenn's tethered horses?
  March 28, 2013 at 9:23AM EST
blockparty

Since this show isn't tackling this (and you'd think they would), maybe I can get a few of you to comment on what you might do in a zombie apocalypse to ensure your survival. Where would you go, how would you fortify your location, how big of a group do you allow, what do you do about food? I'm interested in some of your responses.
November 20, 2011 at 11:50PM EST Reply to Comment
- Numa1 Go to a small island somewhere south/warm. Kill all walkers on island and fish for food. Take boat to mainland periodically for supplies if needed.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:07AM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose Unfortunately, I have a feeling everyone would start thinking of the same good places and they'd all be overcrowded. To paraphrase Yogi Berra: that island's so crowded nobody ever goes there anymore.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:02AM EST
- Col Bat Guano I'd head to a rural farm area after clearing out the nearest Army or National Guard base for weapons. The number of zombies is limited. They don't reproduce so the local population is going to be the only source. You find a small town in Northern California or Southern Oregon, sweep the town for zombies periodically and set up a secure compound. As we saw with Shane and Andrea, each person could easily take out ten zombies at a time. It wouldn't be difficult over time to reduce the risk of attack to a fairly low level.
  November 21, 2011 at 2:35AM EST
- Jason I would go to Alaska and watch the zombies get "freezer burned" over and over again until they are useless piles of meat. Since they cannot reproduce, their numbers would diminish greatly. All I have to do is avoid getting bit. Or I would go to Africa and let the elephants, lions, hyenas and hippos make quick work of the dead. Animals would thrive in this environment which is not good for the walkers, as the animals would become the apex predators. Essentially, I would let nature take its course.
  November 21, 2011 at 3:33AM EST
- Mark in Omaha Since zombies couldn't possibly exist in real life, then I guess any "plan" you have would be good enough. However, we all are subject to various types of disasters. Do you have a disaster plan in place? Supplies? Could you hold out for two weeks with no electricty? If you think stores are bad on Black Friday, how bad would it be if everyone descended on the big box stores at the same time and all wanted the same things (food, water, batteries)? There is a web site called "Equipped to Survive" you should check out. His focus is Earthquakes since that is the region he lives in. His list of items runs 12 pages, how many of the items do you have?
  November 21, 2011 at 12:36PM EST
- Niles McArthur Great question. Probably one that everyone should address. It informs their reactions to any Zombie situation.
  
  I would stay in my 12th floor apt. in a BIG city. Organize neighbors to block the staircases with big crappy furniture just above the Lobby Level to barricade us all in. Immediate fill everything that can hold water, with water. Ration food (never feel full). Wait it out. Worst comes to worse, my hallway could fill with zombies but my steel door and 2 locks will keep them at bay indefinitely. Start on a good sized library of actual books that were left to me. Try not to go absolutely crazy staying inside for a month or more. But the water is really the most important part. Fill the bath tub, water jugs, bags, everything... as that is the most limited resource. I always have atleast 1 month of dry food. Cabinets look weird when not pretty full.
  
  November 21, 2011 at 2:28PM EST
- Bryan L A farm/estate with fences is the way to go. Most people are upset about Hershel's farm being zombie-free, but the zombies for the most part will follow the path of least resistance unless they smell/hear food. So the fact that they don't wander up doesn't bother me -- they won't climb a fence or try to smash through it without motivation.
  
  Ideally, I'd want several fences in concentric "rings" around wherever I was, to make it really tough on stray walkers. Frankly, it's odd that Hershel's family/group isn't fortifying more -- I'd have everybody out putting up fences (even crappy ones) to keep out or slow the riff-raff.
  
  A house on a hill, with an open field of fire, would be good. I'd want a seriously good fence around the house -- probably at least six feet of chain link that I could see and shoot through. Stockpiling would be important, as would protecting/keeping livestock and room for crops. Maybe trenches outside the exterior fence line? Easy to dig, easier than building fences, anyway. Grab a backhoe from somewhere. Too complicated? Form a barricade of abandoned cars. There are hundreds available.
  
  In my scenario, everybody would be armed with machetes at a bare minimum (they're in every hardware store, they don't require training, they're long enough to keep a zombie at a distance). Spears aren't a bad idea either, and I'd be looking into bows -- Daryl's crossbow takes too long to reload. Guns and gun training would be mandatory, but I'd want some other plans in case ammunition got scarce. You can make arrows if necessary and they're frequently reusable. I don't see the problem with the shooting range -- I assumed it was some distance from the farm, it's relatively open, and hopefully someone is always on watch (can't always be sure with this group of idiots -- see "fish fry at quarry" for reference). But nobody should be wasting ammunition on lone walkers (see arrows, machetes, spears above).
  
  I also don't see why they're so worked up about staying with Hershel. Just grab the next farmhouse down the road. I guarantee there are others nearby. Let Hershel keep his zombies if he wants (though he should be securing that barn much better -- back a damn car up against that door while you build another fence around it). If you need medical care, invite Hershel over but tell him to leave the zombies at home.
  
  This is all stuff that constantly occurs to me while I watch the show. I know they can't do all this -- there's not much drama in hanging out in my fortified compound. But the problem is they don't do ANYTHING that normal people would do. I'm no infiltration expert, but I'd walk around that pharmacy first, look for opening zombies could use, and scout every aisle of that store before I started scavenging. That's just common sense. And there's never any common sense on display here. I guess I'm still watching just to criticize, now. And it's occasionally interesting.
  November 22, 2011 at 4:10PM EST
- consideract @Bryan L - Right on. I think we may get to see some other group/s doing sone sensible stuff like this at some point. One could argue it's a big world and, especially in the beginning, people will fumble along and upgrade strategies as necessary, but sometimes you're so right about some of the stupid stuff these guys do, which bothers me most when I don't actually believe such and such a character would do x y or z. I like people to act stupidly sometimes, because we all do, but our stupidities make crude sense much of the time. I would like the writers to get out of the way of the characters more.
  November 22, 2011 at 10:02PM EST
- consideract Oh...your fortified compiund, however, would have plenty of drama. All you need is more than one person in the same vicinity. Possibly just one person, but that is advanced drama! But, more, the drama would be I want in, and you don't want me in. And you only let people in who do things your way, but people get their own ways in their heads, and they start disagreeing with you. Oh, and people have to leave for supplies etc. Just saying, drama is always possible...don't worry, you won't be bored in your fortress!
  November 22, 2011 at 10:11PM EST
Mike.g

I haven't been into the show all that much (I've been watching mostly because my wife is a fan), but felt like from a dramatic standpoint that the show was the best tonight that it has been all season, Up until tonight, the show seemed bogged down in the search for Sophia and the tedious debate between Hershel's group and Rick's group. Tonight, the confrontations and events did a much better job of moving the plot along and providing some interesting character insight. I agree with Alan that the show has been bogged down by being stuck in the same locale, but the bigger problem for me was that these characters weren't developing at all and when they were progressing it seemed ridiculous/out of nowhere (Shane "turning" evil leaps out). The Maggie/Glenn moment came across as a human moment, and the close with Rick and Lori was the first time on the show they seemed like a married couple & not just 2 actors playing a scene together. The show needs more character interplay like this to work. Regardless of whether or not they stay at the farm or hit the road, the show doesn't work if it's just "find the zombies/kill the zombies." That can work in a 90 minute movie. It's not going to work in a weekly television drama.
November 20, 2011 at 11:50PM EST Reply to Comment
JOLO

Seems unfair to not allow a discussion about whether abortion in this world is a legitimate option. It's a pretty significant decision that the Lori character has to make, even if the show copped out and had choose one way and then change her mind. and I realize this will get deleted, I'm more sending this comment directly to you Alan
November 20, 2011 at 11:50PM EST Reply to Comment
- ron mexico I can't blame Alan for having that rule, as it generally seems almost impossible to have reasonable discussions over this sort of thing...
  November 21, 2011 at 12:00AM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose I think in this world there's concomitant question of whether one would have an increased duty to have children to ensure the survival of our species? Maybe restricting the discussion to 'does a zombie apocalypse create such a new duty to procreate' would allow discussion of the general topic in a way that steers around the normal debate parameters. At any rate it would be the tact I would take in trying to convince Hershel to let my people stay if I were Rick. And it's also what I'd argue to convince Alan to let my comments stay :)
  November 21, 2011 at 12:37AM EST
- sepinwall Stop.
  
  Now.
  
  Seriously.
  
  I've been down this road before. You may be behaving now, but eventually people will not behave, and it will be ugly, and I'm not having it.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:40AM EST
- DonBoy Without having any admitted opinion about abortion, I insist on noticing that Herschel/Maggie's belief that their family and friends are sick, and not dead, is meant to be a counterpoint to that issue.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:47AM EST
- DonBoy Mine overlapped with Alan's "STOP", I promise.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:48AM EST
- Brendan Noel I have no opinion of abortion. I'm just really tired of this show and am definitely ready for a break, especially if the second half of the season is going to be as terrible. Get them out of the farm and in the path of actual danger again, i.e. why season one was good.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:57AM EST
- Anon.Z.Moose My last word on the subject is that it's too bad they didn't use turkeys in the barn - coulda counted as their Thanksgiving special. Speaking of T-day: Didn't wish to start the bickering around the family dinner table early and it's probably right that this is the inevitable outcome. So my apologies. Cheers!
  November 21, 2011 at 1:09AM EST
- I wish they would abort the bad writing/wannabe lost crap. Ziiiiiiinnngggg
  November 21, 2011 at 3:17AM EST
- If she keeps it, someone will label the show "pro life." If she doesn't, someone will label the show "pro choice." The whole pregnancy line is to foster more drama. It complicates the Rick/Shane relationship. It complicates the Shane/Andrea relationship. Once word of the "affair" spreads, Lori's character gets a supersized dose of drama. The pregnancy is a typical soap opera ploy
  November 21, 2011 at 5:29AM EST
Tee

I just joined found this show, and am sooo addicted! Went tongue red box 5 times to rent season one before I was able to rent it . I am very dissappointed that they r going on hiatus. Growing up shows didn't do this. We never had to wait a few months. Right before summer, tv shows took a break. So mad! Although I love this show, onagers with our host. This show needs a kick in the ass. Find Sophia already! Move out if hershels already. To bad Shane and Lori aren't together. Not a fan of Andrea. She just gets on my last nerve.
November 21, 2011 at 12:20AM EST Reply to Comment
- Dexx We never had to wait that long cause budgets were different. On network tv we usually get 22 episodes in 36-39 weeks and math dictates that breaks (whether they be one long one, a couple of somewhat long ones, or new shows one week and a repeat the next)are necessary throughout the seasons.
  
  With that in mind we are of course talking about a cable show here and short seasons have always been a standard for cable so long breaks have always happened. Splitting already short cable seasons into 2 parts like The Walking Dead is doing is a newer (but not new) standard but is still a cable standard.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:46AM EST
So it looks like they are speeding the process up on the show. Which is good. I can't imagine what's going to happen next episode. But all I know it wont be good. Prob like a bite or death. Either way I look forward to it.
November 21, 2011 at 12:32AM EST Reply to Comment
- Chris M Honestly if I were in this situation as Rick or Shane I would probalbly secretly make herschel go missing in the night and take over , pull daryl into the barn to just lay waste to everyone in the barn.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:04AM EST
- Achoo What happens next episode is annoyingly obvious: they find zombified Sofia in the barn. Zzzzzzzzzz.
  November 21, 2011 at 4:04AM EST
- bbq_hax0r Have we seen a zombified kid yet? That always adds a particular element.
  November 22, 2011 at 1:24PM EST
- SpyTV Yes, in the pilot. That's the first zombie Rick sees.
  November 22, 2011 at 5:23PM EST
AY

Couple issues:

- Dale might be the smartest man alive. He just happened to have his wife have a reaction to the smell of cooking meat. He figured out Lori and Shane had sex within seconds.

- Lori leaving the abortion pills in only the most open place in the entire place, the most likely place where Shane would see it.

- WHY DON'T THEY JUST TAKE EVERYTHING FROM THE PHARMACY!? They keep risking their lives to go back multiple times for the dumbest little things.

- Where did that horde of zombies come from in the suburb? Don't these things move slow? Shane and Lori were inside maybe 10 min and all of a sudden they come out and blam, an army.
November 21, 2011 at 12:51AM EST Reply to Comment
- DonBoy Dale was using the story of his wife, true ot not, to cover for the fact that Glenn told him about Laurie, just as he told Herschel that he'd happened to be walking past the barn and looked inside. And wasn't he travelling with Laurie/Shane/Carl when we first met him? I imagine it wasn't the world's best kept secret at that point, although that does raise the question of why the whole current group except Rick doesn't know about it.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:56AM EST
- I think that was sarcasm lol. Also, dale said no one knew "for sure", not even him. Key difference imo.
  
  Also, they don't do any of those things bc the writers think they're creating an air of mystery. Unfortunately the writing is transparent and the mysteries are paper thin. Why does every new show think it has to be like lost? God I hate that. Mysterious nonsense does not equal smart writing
  November 21, 2011 at 3:22AM EST
- FINSBURY Dale - I like Dale the sage much better than Dale the busybody.
  
  I want Dale to hand Glen a note and ask him to go to the pharmacy, then have Glen (in the same voice he uses with Lori) say "OMG DALE, WHY DO YOU NEED VIAGRA!).
  November 21, 2011 at 12:37PM EST
- DJF OK I have seen this several times so I must... They do not clear out the pharmacy as there was a sign the 1st time we go there that read something like "please take only what you need". They obviously heed this note in the spirit of what the pharmacy owners intended. Take what you need. Not more. As you need it.
  November 22, 2011 at 9:44AM EST
- bbq_hax0r Agree with DFJ, there was a discussion on the comments here at the time when it happened as well. Something about "small town spirit" and only taking what they need. Maybe there is another group of survivors on a farm on the opposite end of town that is doing the same thing. And, they are going into the pharmacy now for pregnancy related stuff, which is something Herschel is unlikely to need.
  November 22, 2011 at 1:27PM EST
Austin

People always complain about the women characters in this show, me included, but I just realized the women characters in every AMC show have been miserable. No one likes Skyler in Breaking Bad, she's always miserable. Likewise with Mad Men and Betty Draper who comes off as a complete bit** in the last few seasons. It seems as almost none of the women in all these shows have any redeemable, likable qualities.
November 21, 2011 at 12:55AM EST Reply to Comment
- Commander Taylor I think Peggy Olsen and, to a lesser extent, Joan Harris are excellent female characters.
  
  I actually think Skyler became a very interesting character in season 3, but her likability suffered in the process. I don't have a problem with her, but I can understand why others do.
  
  But yeah, Betty Draper is terrible. And the female characters on The Walking Dead are significantly worse.
  
  SONIC WAVE
  November 21, 2011 at 1:47AM EST
- JR What about Joan and especially Peggy from Mad Men? Elizabeth Olsen is a bigger part of that show than Betty, and I'm kind of hoping we see even less of January Jones next season.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:50AM EST
- leahblizz I would definitely agree with you that the females in TWD are BEYOND horrible, but I think other AMC shows have a balance of good and bad female characters (as you'd expect a show to have a balance of good and bad male characters). I know a lot of people hate Skyler White, but I like her. I think it's because Walt is the main character, and when anybody gives him crap they hate it...even if it's the long-suffering wife who's husband is a methlord.
  
  As for Mad Men, Betty after season 3 is just as despicable as other characters on the show. I would be suspicious if all the female characters were awesome like Peggy and Joan.
  November 21, 2011 at 6:19PM EST
- leahblizz I would definitely agree with you that the females in TWD are BEYOND horrible, but I think other AMC shows have a balance of good and bad female characters (as you'd expect a show to have a balance of good and bad male characters). I know a lot of people hate Skyler White, but I like her. I think it's because Walt is the main character, and when anybody gives him crap they hate it...even if it's the long-suffering wife who's husband is a methlord.
  
  As for Mad Men, Betty after season 3 is just as despicable as other characters on the show. I would be suspicious if all the female characters were awesome like Peggy and Joan.
  November 21, 2011 at 6:19PM EST
- leahblizz ...posted twice for some reason...
  November 21, 2011 at 6:20PM EST
- stanforduniversity A few of you said the bwriters of AMC shows, such as breaking b and MM are all awlful. In walking dead they have nothing redeeming to like. But Betty Draper role requires her to be a B***. If she didn't Don would be different and the show would not be what it is. Same for Skylar, she certainly has to wonder about Walt's behavior. She shouldn't be acting like Luci of Luci and Desi. Walking dead is stale, they need to regroup to continue. Even to gain anything that they had.
  November 24, 2011 at 2:54AM EST
CHRIS M

Honestly if I were in this situation as Rick or Shane I would probalbly secretly make herschel go missing in the night and take over , pull daryl into the barn to just lay waste to everyone in the barn.
November 21, 2011 at 1:05AM EST Reply to Comment
chudleycannonfodder

Anyone watch Talking Dead? Got really frustrated with Chris Hardwick because he kept referencing stuff that happened in the comics without any warning. SPOILERS MAN!
November 21, 2011 at 1:38AM EST Reply to Comment
- Nick The show has been so damn dull, I was glad to get those references. Supplied some hope that - GASP - something may actually happen!
  November 21, 2011 at 5:59AM EST
Paradox

The first half of the episode was tedious to the level of "Why am I watching this?" If you cut that part out, it could have been the best episode of the season. The pharmacy zombie, the sequence in the housing division, Dale and Shane, Rick and Lori - that was all really good. Outside of the part where she complains about here son learning to shoot, Lori had some parts that I didn't hate and were actually, daresay, good.
November 21, 2011 at 1:40AM EST Reply to Comment
The show seems to be following a likely scenario in a zombie apocalypse (initial zombie boom, partial zombie die off/survivor complacency, and most likely culminating in a final "showdown" followed by the rebuilding of civilization). Combined with the completely inescapable fact that the show is based on a graphic novel, I'm very forgiving of the plot.

What this season has done is draw distinctions between what I see as the four types of survivors:

Darryl (loner survivalist) - probably the most rare type. If he were to do it completely alone (or had stayed paired with his brother), he would have most certainly survived with little problem. This path, unfortunately, is a dead end. You can't rebuild civilization if everyone else is dead.

Hershal (wait it out) - If his house weren't in the middle of nowhere, he would be dead just like everyone else who chose to bury their heads in the sand and hope for the best.

Shane (military style) - cold, calculating, and almost entirely detached. This type can only survive by removing all emotion and viewing the world in one way... Kill or be killed. Rick showing up and claiming his family forced Shane deeper down this path. With whats-her-face-hobag being pregnant, Shane will take this to the extreme as Rick becomes more than an obstacle, but an enemy.

Finally, the hero...
Rick (surviving morality) - there's a reason the show revolves around this guy. He's supposed to represent what's good in all of us. Unwaivering moral fortitude, confidence in humanity, and a protective instinct. He does the right thing even when he's not sure it's the best thing to do. He is the hope of civilization. Survivors like this will group together and are the only true hope for mankind.

While the Shanes and the Ricks may be beneficial to each other during the onslaught, when the smoke settles, the Shanes of the world will have no place in a "civilized society." Sooner or later, the Shanes will realize they are on the cusp of the end of their usefulness and turn on the Ricks.

November 21, 2011 at 1:55AM EST Reply to Comment
- stinkweed Lori might be vapid, wonk-eyed and stupid, but I'd have to object to her being a "hobag". She thought her husband was dead, was in the middle of the apocalypse and sought some solace with a man she knew well. That's not whoredom, that's just being human.
  November 21, 2011 at 9:01AM EST
- consideract Very telling analysis. Also, see ancient Chinese views of power in NY Times oped about China vs. America.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:06PM EST
- consideract @Stinkweed - I agree. She had every right to explore her options. I'm glad Rick gets that. I don't see any point in calling her names.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:09PM EST
- SolarRob Kevin, your insight is okay on the characters, but do you really think it will ever be the same again? Come on, it's a fairy tale to think that. Today's American's have already forgotten what it takes to survive. If it wasn't for Shane and Daryl, most of those mamby pamby group members would be done for. All they are good for is cannon fodder. They need to stop feeling sorry and sad for themselves and live. Rebuilding a society thinking that things can go back to the way they used too... Come on. It sounds all nice and peachy but there's a reason survivalist use the phrase "The End Of The World As We Know It". There is no more society the way you envision, just surviving. It's now just a Scavenger World for them. I hope they all survive and find a place of there own. Just know it's not going to be because of Lori, Dale, Andrea, and Carol. It's going to be the hard word and decisions of Shane, Daryl, Glenn, and I'm hoping T-dog steps up more. Everyone wants to have some of Rick's Idealistic dreams. But it's never going to happen in the reality they're living.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:42PM EST
- FINSBURY Hershal World/Zombie View v. Rick/Group World/Zombie View:
  
  One thing I really enjoyed about Season 1 was each character had a different experience in going from normal life, to zombie apocolypse, to the camp by the quarry. Each character was coming to grips with their new reality at a different pace with a different history.
  
  I like that we now see Hershel, who because the farm is isolated, has a completely understanding of the zombie world reality.
  
  The group went to the CDC. At the CDC, they learned the scientific reality behind the "zombie plague". It confirmed what the group saw in living and dying with zombies, and seeing characters - Andrea's sister and the Dad who was bitten and slowly transformed in the RV before the put him by the road.
  
  But Hershel (and Maggie, until her world view was shattered by the pharmact attack) have different experiences. Apparently, they were able to herd the zombies into the barn without alot of human or zombie death on either side. Hershel and the folks on the farm haven't been shocked or CDC's into the reality Rick's group live in.
  
  I just wish it hadn't taken so many episodes to explore it.
  
  November 21, 2011 at 12:51PM EST
- consideract @Solarrob - Daryl is a way better man than Shane will ever be, in my estimation. They are not really comparable in this way, just because they both are good at killing walkers. Shane, as I see it, may be good at self-survival, but he is a danger to the group's survival, at least if he continues down the path he seems to be taking. Long-term survival takes a group. Groups need all kinds, and if it weren't for other "lesser" members, Shane, for one, would be done for. The supposed classic loser, Otis, saved Shane's life early on in the episode, before Shane then sacrificed him. Just for one example. Moreover, I would argue separately, that humanity has faced immense hardship before, just surviving long enough to create civilization in the first place. Compared to human history, walkers are not really the worst thing we have been through. Really nasty, but the real question, a question beyond the life of the show, which is probably never going to deal with it in any real way, is how long will the walkers persist. It's just a fictional universe, and they can sidestep that point, but if we use the show to talk about real life survival strategies, building a future, societies of whatever kind, is top of the list. The walkers are a fictional way of smashing characters against hard realities, but all such fiction remains hopelessly optimistic, simply because as long as there is a story, there is existence, people surviving. Such is my seventeen cents, at any rate...
  November 22, 2011 at 9:47PM EST
Linda B.

The morning-after pill does not cause an abortion. It won't work if you're already pregnant, like Laurie. The morning-after pill needs to be taken within five days of unprotected sex, in order to prevent pregnancy from occurring. It can prevent ovulation, block fertilization, or prevent implantation of a fertilized egg.
November 21, 2011 at 1:57AM EST Reply to Comment
- comfy chair It was brought up in-show that they were unsure that it would work. Maybe Lori should have consulted with Herschel.
  November 21, 2011 at 2:44AM EST
- If enough are taken early enough, it will cause you to abort. Gynos use them if there is no detectable heartbeat after 6 or 7 weeks. But you have to take several. Any longer than about 8 weeks and they go to other "options"
  November 21, 2011 at 4:22AM EST
- stinkweed And somehow I doubt that they have a big ol' "Morning After!!!!" label.
  November 21, 2011 at 9:03AM EST
consideract

I don't mind a more casual rhythm or pace. I like the country pace. That works just fine. I have more trouble with characters acting stupidly when they shouldn't be. I have no trouble with stupid actions that are real, and not contrivances. I think contrivances, not country rhythms, hurt the dramatic pace. There is plenty of drama here to be exploited otherwise.
November 21, 2011 at 2:33AM EST Reply to Comment
consideract

Shane thinks he is making the hard decisions necessary for this new reality. He isn't. He is making the easy choices.
November 21, 2011 at 2:44AM EST Reply to Comment
jeremiah_dollins

I'm getting near the end of my rope with this show. I still harbor enough good will from season 1 to continue through to the end of season 2, but it's getting tougher, especially after tonight's poor outing. Here are a few thoughts:

1. Why is Carl walking around? Didn't he just have invasive surgery? In my experience, invasive abdominal surgery requires a good six weeks to fully heal, and most people are bed ridden for two weeks. With their limited medical facilities, you would think the group would be forcing him to stay in bed, let alone allow him to bend over, kneel down, and practice shooting a firearm. Huh?

2. Andrea's hookup with Shane has been eluded to, but was handled with all the elegance of a fart joke. Seriously, they go from Shane prodding her while doing target practice, to shooting up a neighborhood full of zombies to screwing in the front seat of a compact car. No flirtation. No sexual tension. Just sex. At least when Herschel's daughter kissed Glen after blowing up at Laurie, there was precedent for her behavior.

3. I'm very annoyed at the lack of character motivations beyond the obvious. We are 12 episodes into the series and the only character we have any true back story on is Daryl. We've had glimpses of Rick, Shane, and Lori, but it's all cursory, fill-in-the-gaps sort of stuff. There's very little actual characterization going on here. If I knew more about Dale, I might not find his nosiness and general meddlesome attitude so grating, or think of Andrea as a cold, whiny bitch.

I could go on, but much of what I have to say has already been said by others here. As a fan of this series, I'm very disappointed it has taken such a turn for the worse.
November 21, 2011 at 3:07AM EST Reply to Comment
- houseofjenny re: #2, Andrea is feeling her power. And when she does, guess who's with her? Another powerful someone. Two big guns exploding in the sun. Cue another grab...
  November 21, 2011 at 6:13PM EST
SomeGuy

What I liked about the comics was the relentless pace - things just kept happening (of course it also depends on how fast you read them).

But they are taking way too long on the show. Get with it already.
November 21, 2011 at 3:17AM EST Reply to Comment
amy

The Sofia thing is dragged on waayyy to long.
November 21, 2011 at 3:45AM EST Reply to Comment
Dan

I'm enjoying the season. But it's time for the sophia plot thread to get resolved. Next week is the last episode before february. I'll be very disappointed if it's not resolved before the break.
November 21, 2011 at 3:59AM EST Reply to Comment
armofatlas

I really would like a timeline for all this stuff. How long was Rick in the hospital? How long has Sophia been gone? How long have they been on the farm? These things aren't lining up for me.
November 21, 2011 at 4:43AM EST Reply to Comment
- RU Serious The timeline is crucial, but they're never going to address it because it will never make sense, particularly the Rick Shane Lori thing. Rick's coma, where she thought he might be dead, could only have been what, a couple weeks, max, before he'd have died of dehydration in the hospital bed unattended? So in the two weeks, she not only banged this guy, her husband's best friend (I GUES I can make the leap to one time, but that's meeting this show more than halfway, as a way to 'feel something' which is about the lamest writing ever), but she forged a relationship with him? By the time Rick wakes up, he'd have only been out of commission for a couple of weeks tops (or dead from lack of care). I'm suposed to understand her basically having a new boyfriend after two weeks? Frig that.
  November 21, 2011 at 10:04AM EST
- Suzombie Remember in the hospital, the flowers. That gave us the timing of how long. Shane dropped off the flowers, then when Rick woke up the flowers were dried and dead, suggesting a couple of weeks had passed.
  November 21, 2011 at 11:32AM EST
- paper Lori and Rick already had trouble as a couple, so it's not like she completely went from 0 to 60 in two seconds. I myself also have never understood this idea we have about how much time between relationships is acceptable. It's not so much about time, as an emotional decision, acceptance, realization that it is time to move on. But in terms of the writing, yes, they do seem to be leaving the timeline a bit vague.
  November 21, 2011 at 12:14PM EST
- RU Serious The show didn't do any kind of job showing us that they were in severe enough marital strife that both she and his best friend would think it was okay to start banging after TWO WEEKS. I know, call me prudish, but two weeks isn't enough 'time', even in a zombie apocalypes, to move on from someone who's dead that you had a ten plus year relationship and a child with. That's soft, if you ask me. I'd buy it better if it was a one time mistake type thing, but that's not what the show gave us, either. They were clearly carrying on a relationship, as if for months.
  November 21, 2011 at 1:16PM EST
- Elevation I would imagine Shane and Lori enjoyed each other's company a bit pre Rick coma.
  November 21, 2011 at 5:43PM EST
- RU Serious Based on what evidence provided by the show, other than the fact they were banging in the woods in ep1? If they were, then Lori's character is completely compromised, because her heartfelt confession to Rick in this episode isn't about a long term affair predating his coma, which DOES make her a liar and a hobag. The only way their behavior makes sense is if they were indeed banging pre-coma, but that makes Lori a coward, Shane a sleaze bag (before his more interesting character turn in the show thereafter) and Rick a clueless sot. I'm pretty sure that's not what the show wants you to think about any of these people.
  November 22, 2011 at 9:43AM EST

Review: 'The Walking Dead' - 'Secrets': Target practice

Are you a fan of The Walking Dead?

Sign up to get the latest updates instantly.

Never miss a post - sign up now to get an e-mail alert whenever The Walking Dead is updated

Alan Sepinwall Recaps & Reviews

Comments

Option 1

Option 2

Option 3

John I only watch a limited number of shows, but I can't imagine there are any worse characters on any show than Andrea and Dale. Horribly written, horribly acted, no redeeming or interesting qualities at all.

Other John The son in Terra Nova. Worst character on tv now.

Ian I pretty much agree. But then again, I pretty much hate EVERY character on this show.I'd be very happy if everyone but Daryl died. I could watch a show where each week Daryl will just wander around through the woods and kill zombies. It would be a massive improvement over this hot mess.

I've decided that darryl needs to fall through a wormhole with a few walkers and let them wipe out Terra Nova so that we can have what will surely win the Oscar for beat show ever: Daryl Dixon and Commander Taylor do stuff. Your welcome for that idea (that I partially ripped off)

James @CORY: Oscars are for movies, not tv shows

Jack I'm only responding to this because I like the idea of a debate about the worst character TV show character. Taco, from "The League", gets my vote.

LMFAOSHMSFOAIDMT (laughing my effin arse off so hard that my sombrero fell off and I dropped my taco) @ James. It was sarcasm and a talladega nights reference :P

Wylie76 Oh please, nobody comes close to Tara on True Blood in terms of annoying characters.

ZDT I agree, and what's really sad is that Andrea and Dale are two of my favorites in the comics. Andrea is very strong and a leader of the group there, versus whatever she is in the show...certainly not that.

renee Reply to comment...i agree!

Duane Reply to comment...i completely agree!!

GarySF What's Zost?

Mark in Omaha Taking a guess that it's Lost with Zombies.

+1 for Mark :D

Bill I still enjoy the show but not as much as season one. I liked it for the action and this season is lacking in that department. How do you think Dale knew they hooked up?

consideract Dale was just paying attention, which is probably what I appreciate most about his character. Andrea's smile, the glances and looking away, the hesitations, click click click, figures it out. Just paying attention.

JB I'm pretty sure there were hicky marks on Andrea's neck as well - a clear indication that something happened with Shane. Dale isn't stupid; he figured it out.

Alex T. Agree with Cory, here. Shane definitely had a lot of potential, especially compared to every other character in the show, as far as character development, and I think the writers blew it now...he is starting to be one dimensional.

Bill I'd like more flashbacks to the apocalypse like the opening scene last week too.

Daryl/Merle would be cool, but with such an obviously hamstrung budget, is rather they focus on the present than having to spend big $$ on vfx

JB I'd like more flashbacks, too - kind of in the style of "LOST", where the flashbacks would set the scene for something that was about to go down in that episode. Or to find out more about the backstory of each character.

Oh god, please no more attempts to Lostify the show. Lost was very well executed and 90% of shows these days bumble their attempts to mimic it.

George Did Dale say that Carl stole the gun under the pretense of borrowing a walkie talkie? I wasn't sure if I heard that right because I definitely think there have been some times when walkie-talkies would have come in handy for this group.

Chimpotle As far as I know, Rick only uses the walkie to try and check in with the guy and his son who helped in Season 1. Makes perfect sense to send Carl to get it for his dad.

Mikepdoyle Great post. I feel the same way.

Eldritch "And why do the walkers need to be fed, anyway? " Exactly my question. Why do they need to eat? And exactly why do their legs need to be broken? They can't catch chickens trapped in a barn with them? And my bonus question is, do zombies share chickens equally with one another?

Hollywoodaholic Exactly. And if Walkers can eat chickens, why do they need humans? Or Brraaaaiiinnnnnss? At this point they're really not much different than us and should just hang out in a cow pasture munching fresh beef. (We prefer it dead and tasteless, of course)

Jim Maggie Q - And did Lori ask for the pills by brand name?I laughed out loud when I backed up the TIVO to see that the pills were labeled.....wait for it.....Morning After Pills. As if this was the drug name from the manufacturer.

LisaMc As far as the walkers "needing" to eat, remember the walker Darryl and Andrea found hanging in the tree? Other walkers had eaten his legs. If nothing else, Hershel et al. may be using the chickens to keep their barn residents relatively whole.

comfy chair yes please!

consideract Yes, I hope Glen gets a chance to grow and make a difference here. I loved his comment to Lori about maybe she might not want to make such a decision by herself.

Lee I was also amused that Maggie got indignant when Glen called the barn residents "walkers", as if it was a racial slur. I half-expected Kramer to show up to accuse Glen of being an "anti-Walkite."

Elevation Being one of the best characters on this show is like being the smartest tree.

The_NV As someone who had been largely disappointed with this season to this point, I gotta say I found this episode to be very satisfying. Best episode of the season, so far.

Joe Corey, you really do seem to spend a lot of time commenting on a show you don't like....

Fuzzbrain Lori is worried about a newborn baby crying, but they're blowing away cans like it's a shooting gallery at a state fair?! LOL

Froide How come no zombies attacked Maggie and Glenn's tethered horses?

Numa1 Go to a small island somewhere south/warm. Kill all walkers on island and fish for food. Take boat to mainland periodically for supplies if needed.

Anon.Z.Moose Unfortunately, I have a feeling everyone would start thinking of the same good places and they'd all be overcrowded. To paraphrase Yogi Berra: that island's so crowded nobody ever goes there anymore.

ron mexico I can't blame Alan for having that rule, as it generally seems almost impossible to have reasonable discussions over this sort of thing...

sepinwall Stop. Now. Seriously. I've been down this road before. You may be behaving now, but eventually people will not behave, and it will be ugly, and I'm not having it.

DonBoy Without having any admitted opinion about abortion, I insist on noticing that Herschel/Maggie's belief that their family and friends are sick, and not dead, is meant to be a counterpoint to that issue.

DonBoy Mine overlapped with Alan's "STOP", I promise.

Brendan Noel I have no opinion of abortion. I'm just really tired of this show and am definitely ready for a break, especially if the second half of the season is going to be as terrible. Get them out of the farm and in the path of actual danger again, i.e. why season one was good.

I wish they would abort the bad writing/wannabe lost crap. Ziiiiiiinnngggg

So it looks like they are speeding the process up on the show. Which is good. I can't imagine what's going to happen next episode. But all I know it wont be good. Prob like a bite or death. Either way I look forward to it.

Chris M Honestly if I were in this situation as Rick or Shane I would probalbly secretly make herschel go missing in the night and take over , pull daryl into the barn to just lay waste to everyone in the barn.

Achoo What happens next episode is annoyingly obvious: they find zombified Sofia in the barn. Zzzzzzzzzz.

bbq_hax0r Have we seen a zombified kid yet? That always adds a particular element.

SpyTV Yes, in the pilot. That's the first zombie Rick sees.

FINSBURY Dale - I like Dale the sage much better than Dale the busybody. I want Dale to hand Glen a note and ask him to go to the pharmacy, then have Glen (in the same voice he uses with Lori) say "OMG DALE, WHY DO YOU NEED VIAGRA!).

JR What about Joan and especially Peggy from Mad Men? Elizabeth Olsen is a bigger part of that show than Betty, and I'm kind of hoping we see even less of January Jones next season.

leahblizz ...posted twice for some reason...

CHRIS M Honestly if I were in this situation as Rick or Shane I would probalbly secretly make herschel go missing in the night and take over , pull daryl into the barn to just lay waste to everyone in the barn.

chudleycannonfodder Anyone watch Talking Dead? Got really frustrated with Chris Hardwick because he kept referencing stuff that happened in the comics without any warning. SPOILERS MAN!

Nick The show has been so damn dull, I was glad to get those references. Supplied some hope that - GASP - something may actually happen!

stinkweed Lori might be vapid, wonk-eyed and stupid, but I'd have to object to her being a "hobag". She thought her husband was dead, was in the middle of the apocalypse and sought some solace with a man she knew well. That's not whoredom, that's just being human.

consideract Very telling analysis. Also, see ancient Chinese views of power in NY Times oped about China vs. America.

consideract @Stinkweed - I agree. She had every right to explore her options. I'm glad Rick gets that. I don't see any point in calling her names.

comfy chair It was brought up in-show that they were unsure that it would work. Maybe Lori should have consulted with Herschel.

If enough are taken early enough, it will cause you to abort. Gynos use them if there is no detectable heartbeat after 6 or 7 weeks. But you have to take several. Any longer than about 8 weeks and they go to other "options"

stinkweed And somehow I doubt that they have a big ol' "Morning After!!!!" label.

Never miss a post - sign up now to get an e-mail alert whenever
The Walking Dead is updated

John

I only watch a limited number of shows, but I can't imagine there are any worse characters on any show than Andrea and Dale. Horribly written, horribly acted, no redeeming or interesting qualities at all.

Ian I pretty much agree. But then again, I pretty much hate EVERY character on this show.

I'd be very happy if everyone but Daryl died. I could watch a show where each week Daryl will just wander around through the woods and kill zombies. It would be a massive improvement over this hot mess.

I've decided that darryl needs to fall through a wormhole with a few walkers and let them wipe out Terra Nova so that we can have what will surely win the Oscar for beat show ever: Daryl Dixon and Commander Taylor do stuff.

Your welcome for that idea (that I partially ripped off)

Bill

I still enjoy the show but not as much as season one. I liked it for the action and this season is lacking in that department. How do you think Dale knew they hooked up?

Bill

I'd like more flashbacks to the apocalypse like the opening scene last week too.

George

Did Dale say that Carl stole the gun under the pretense of borrowing a walkie talkie? I wasn't sure if I heard that right because I definitely think there have been some times when walkie-talkies would have come in handy for this group.

Eldritch
"And why do the walkers need to be fed, anyway? "

Exactly my question.

Why do they need to eat?

And exactly why do their legs need to be broken? They can't catch chickens trapped in a barn with them?

And my bonus question is, do zombies share chickens equally with one another?

Jim Maggie Q - And did Lori ask for the pills by brand name?

I laughed out loud when I backed up the TIVO to see that the pills were labeled.....wait for it.....Morning After Pills. As if this was the drug name from the manufacturer.

The_NV

As someone who had been largely disappointed with this season to this point, I gotta say I found this episode to be very satisfying. Best episode of the season, so far.

sepinwall Stop.

Now.

Seriously.

I've been down this road before. You may be behaving now, but eventually people will not behave, and it will be ugly, and I'm not having it.

FINSBURY Dale - I like Dale the sage much better than Dale the busybody.

I want Dale to hand Glen a note and ask him to go to the pharmacy, then have Glen (in the same voice he uses with Lori) say "OMG DALE, WHY DO YOU NEED VIAGRA!).

CHRIS M

Honestly if I were in this situation as Rick or Shane I would probalbly secretly make herschel go missing in the night and take over , pull daryl into the barn to just lay waste to everyone in the barn.

chudleycannonfodder

Anyone watch Talking Dead? Got really frustrated with Chris Hardwick because he kept referencing stuff that happened in the comics without any warning. SPOILERS MAN!