Review: 'Community' - 'Geography of Global Conflict': Rage against the machine
Alan and Todd VanDerWerff talk about the difference between "normal" and "abnormal" episodes
Annie (Alison Brie) has an idea on "Community."
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A quick review of tonight's "Community" - followed by an anything-but-quick discussion between me and Todd VanDerWerff about the current state of the series - coming up just as soon as I have a multi-cultural evil twin...
Given the lousy ratings the season premiere got last week, Todd and I wound up taking to Twitter this afternoon to urge people to watch tonight's episode (and tonight's "Parks and Recreation") live. I hadn't seen "Geography of Global Conflict" in advance, and while I enjoyed parts of it - Annie's tantrum, the floating heads of squeaky-voiced Garret, the first Chang/Britta scene with the eaten, half-swallowed warning note - it did feel a little lightweight compared to some of my favorite episodes of the series, and not necessarily the one I would have raised a This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things call to arms about. (Though I apparently got a few of my Twitter followers to check out the show for the first time, they didn't seem impressed.)
And that got me thinking about a subject we talked about a lot last year: this ongoing shift between the high-concept episodes of "Community" and more normal episodes like this one that are just about life at a community college - albeit a strange one populated by strange people. And I began IM'ing with Todd - who, like me, loved the second season and its push deeper and deeper into the conceptual waters - about whether we'd reached a point where, for us at least, episodes like this one simply feel lacking compared to the ones where the study group is being attacked by zombies, turned into Claymation holiday figures or appearing in a fake clip show. And after a few brief exchanges - and Todd finishing up his own review of the episode for The AV Club - we realized it might be useful to start over from scratch, talk at greater length, and record the discussion for posterity. So here's what we had to say about The State of "Community" Season 3 - or whatever it is we can glean about it after a measly two episodes:
Alan: Let's start here: while there were some amusing parts of this episode, I was not in love with it overall. You?
Todd: I didn't love it, but I didn't hate it either. It struck me as a perfectly acceptable, middle of the road episode, of the sort the show seemed to briefly forget how to do down the stretch of season two.
Alan: Okay, but here's what I'm curious about: the season has now opened with back-to-back episodes that, for lack of a better word, we could classify as "normal" episodes of "Community." No high-concept, no unique structure or tone, no modeling the entire episode around a well-known movie or TV show. And though both have had their moments, neither one seems likely to wind up on any fan's Best Episodes Ever list. So is this just a case of the season taking its time getting into a groove (like, say, the first few episodes of this season of "Breaking Bad"), or has the show reached a point where it doesn't know how to do the non-conceptual episodes as well as the wacky ones?
Todd: We were talking about this a little earlier (and I was talking about it with Alyssa Rosenberg as well), and I got to looking at old seasons on Wikipedia, and I realized something: EVERY season of Community has started slow, relative to what came later. Every season starts out laying the groundwork for what's to come, then starts to go crazy around episode seven or eight. I think that season two just went so far over the moon that we've forgotten that that season, too, started off in a relatively grounded place. Even the space shuttle episode is nowhere near as audacious as stuff that came later.
Alan: But Apollo 13 was the fourth episode, zombies the sixth, the bottle episode - which was "normal" in terms of taking place only in the study room, but which called attention to itself for doing so - was the eighth, conspiracy thriller the ninth, etc... It may have taken them a few weeks, but then they started banging out those puppies with great frequency.
Todd: Sure. But the first two were both "normal" episodes (or, more accurately, "low-concept" episodes). And I think if we're comparing this to a typical "normal" episode in season two, I'd take either the premiere or the second episode over something like "Competitive Wine Tasting," which really felt phoned in. The show really seems to be TRYING this year, trying to win over some of the people who wrote it off as too weird. And while that might end up creating episodes that seem to be straining too hard to seem normal, there's more thought put into them than into the relatively listless "normals" from the back half of season two.
Alan: It did seem like there was a schism between fans last season. Some loved the audaciousness and execution of the high-concept episodes and thought it was a season for the ages, while others missed the season one feel where things were (relatively) normal before chicken fingers and paintball showed us the extremes to which the show could go. And I have to confess that I fall into that first camp. When we were talking earlier, you said that the second half of season two had some issues, and I rattled off a list of great episodes, all of which were the high-concept ones (D&D, documentary, My Dinner with Abed, etc.), and while I know I enjoyed some of the "normal" episodes, I've largely forgotten them.
Alan: But where's the ultimate balance? Obviously, the show has some ratings issues, and obviously there's a split (percentages unknown) even among its small number of fans. What number of "normal" (if there is such a thing) episodes vs. abnormal ones is acceptable to everyone? I like the idea of trying to marry the best of both worlds, and I think they did that with a number of the high-concept episodes last year. "Mixology Certification" and "Critical Film Studies" are both very, very character-driven, even as they're tonally unlike anything the show did before and, in the case of the latter, modeled very heavily on a cult film classic. But not everyone liked even those, and I worry that for the people who've grown to love the cuckoo bananas episodes, it's hard to take as much satisfaction out of a well-executed episode with a more traditional structure and tone.
Todd: Sure. That's the question, isn't it? Once the show does a high-concept episode so well, do you ever even WANT a low-concept episode? Or put another way, I gave both this episode and the space shuttle one a B. But I know which one I'll be more likely to remember when thinking about the show later on down the line, even though I'd say they're roughly the same (and this one probably made me laugh more).
At the same time, though, it's obvious that if the show just follows the high-concept episodes down the rabbit hole, that eventually leads to a series where it's all but impossible to care about the basic reality of the show or its characters, something that became too much for a lot of viewers--and critics I really respect--last season.
I, personally, love shows that could be a different KIND of show every week, but for a lot of people, that violates the bond they make with the show. So the tricky thing to do is figure out a way to be Community but also be, recognizably, a more "normal" sitcom.
I'm not sure it can be done, but I think the premiere, especially, showed a way to do it.
Alan: True, the premiere did manage to tell a few actual Greendale stories while working in a musical number, a "2001" homage, etc. But I also thought it got a little bogged down in plot at times. Maybe my concern is just that we've started the season with two good-but-not-great episodes that also fit into the somewhat misshapen box we call the "normal" episodes. The second episode of season 2 (the second one they showed, anyway; I know there was some shuffling) was "Accounting for Lawyers," which I would probably also stuff in that box, but it had one of the single funniest scenes in the history of the show with Annie chlorofoming the guard.
So it's entirely possible I'm just overreacting to these first two episodes, rather than it being part of a larger trend where they're having trouble making the non-concept episodes work
Todd: It's also just, generally, hard to start a comedy season well. I didn't like the Parks & Rec premiere very much, outside of the Leslie and Ben scenes (though I'll admit tonight's episode is a stone-cold classic). It's so tough to make sure you've got the storylines spinning along, while also getting the jokes in there.
I've found that "Community" is at its best when it isn't trying so hard. Now, that sounds paradoxical, given all of the crazy stuff the show does. But when it just settles down and accepts that sometimes it does episodes with zombies in them, and that's OK, it tends to make better episodes. I have so much faith that we'll look back on this momentary hiccup like we're doing with "Breaking Bad" now, where we see all of the groundwork these episodes are laying.
It could just be that I read a whole bunch of stuff into the season premiere, but it really does feel like this season is trying to build a big story about acceptance and how we define ourselves and how those definitions change. And that wouldn't be easy to set up in five episodes, much less two. But these first two episodes laid a tremendous amount of plot, character, and thematic pipeline. Maybe it won't pay off, and we'll all be ruing the missteps of the season. That's always the danger with stuff like this. But I really feel like we're going to be pleased with how this all works out.
Alan: No, I'm not incredibly worried overall. I'm just going to be curious, going forward, to see how the show works that balance of tone and style, and also whether they can find ways to please fans of one brand of episode when they're making the other kind. Again, allowing that both kinds are incredibly fluid. You and I can't even agree on which category to put "Mixology Certification" into.
Todd: And there are absolutely plenty of people who strongly dislike "Mixology" (an episode that improves for me every time I watch it). It's a show that tries so many things and succeeds at so many of them that it will inevitably end up disappointing at least some viewers with every episode. I'm already getting people Tweeting at me about how this episode blends season one with season two in a way they really enjoy. But I do hope the show finds a way to stick some of the craziness back in, while keeping with the more grounded tone it wants this year. A whole season of "Mixology"s? I could definitely handle that.
Alan: Well, in terms of what you say about what you see as the big themes of the season, this does seem a crucial time for the series, whether we get additional seasons or not. The characters have been together for two years now. They've matured, come to accept each other, etc. - and the show has commented on those changes. Jeff gave a big speech in the clip show about how he can't solve every problem with a big speech anymore. Jeff and Annie talk here about how their friendship needs to evolve (if not turn into the romance that some fans want). Britta's freaking out about growing up and tries to retreat back into her anti-establishment poses, even if it's in a totally defanged way that's as much about making Chang feel better as herself. But lots of these devices - the speeches, the Jeff/Annie sexual tension, Pierce being a racist jackass - have been pretty consistent sources of good comedy and/or emotion for the show. How do they let the characters grow up without altering the chemistry of what worked? I know this is a problem that LOTS of TV shows (virtually anyone with even the slightest bit of ambition) deals with at some point or another, but it feels especially tricky here because the show and the characters are so damn self-aware. If Jeff and Abed weren't constantly commenting on the nature of the action - whether in high or low-concept outings - would this be as big an issue? And how much will that maturation complicate this attempt to blend the two sides of the series?
Todd: This has always been the problem with the show, at least since they figured out it worked much better an an ensemble show than as a "Jeff Winger is Bill Murray circa 1982, and everybody's going to make him a better person" show.
There needs to be a certain degree of maturation that, nonetheless, leaves room for comic hijinks, which are necessarily immature. And because the show is always cognizant of how far its characters have come (and how far they still have to go), it's always going to be at war with some of its own comedic engines. And that drives a lot of uncertainty for fans of the show sometimes. It's a problem that a show like Happy Endings--much as I laugh at that show--will never have, and it's a problem that even shows with similar levels of ambition to Community don't have to tackle in the same way. This is a show that's always had a lot of character ambition, but to alter the characters too much will damage the show's ability to be funny. And I admire that the show is tackling that head-on this year.
Alan: So what we have here are two separate but possibly interlocking problems: 1)How do we please a split fanbase that prefers one kind of episode over the other (and make each kind as effective as possible, regardless of audience preference)? and 2)How do we let our characters grow up without taking away the things that define them (plus all the butt jokes)? Two episodes is a pitifully small sample size, and as you say, comedies - particularly quasi-serialized comedies like this one - tend to take a while to get going each season. So do you feel confident extrapolating anything about the season's creative prospects from these 2 episodes? Or should you and I just shut up and wait to see the inevitable tribute to "Just One of the Guys"?
Todd: I think we're dealing with the show finally digging into just why these people matter to each other and where this journey will go for them, ultimately. I alone seemed to read the musical opening last week as sad, but I think if you listen to the lyrics, it's all there. This is a season about what people wish they were--happy, an activist, someone who gets all the gold stars--and how far they've fallen short of that. And how Greendale lets that be OK. Maybe the show will fall short of that. Maybe it will simply cease being funny and become too pretentious. But I do know that I think this season is building to something special, and I hope we'll all have the patience to wait and see what happens. Just reading the episode descriptions indicates some pretty cool "high-concept" type things coming up. Here's hoping they show that this show hasn't lost it.
So that's enough us. What did everybody else think of the episode? And how are you feeling about the show as a whole right now?
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September 29, 2011 at 11:47PM EST Reply to CommentThe Britta storyline was the weakest link but otherwise I thought it was a solid B+. You can't make TV history every week. I just worry about the ratings on this thing. I know it got a full season order but that can change at anytime.
r1pvanw1nkl3
September 29, 2011 at 11:47PM EST Reply to CommentI enjoyed these first two episodes a lot. Tonight's episode wasn't the most memorable, but it got a good amount of laughs from me.
On the topic of the show as a whole, I feel like too much ambition might end up being the downfall of this show. They seemed a bit heavy-handed towards the end of the episode with Jeff and Annie and the changing nature of their relationship. In a show that can do so much with its structure and storytelling, it wouldn't be too much of a crime to stick with what works with the characters. On the other hand, Dan Harmon has shown so much care and dedication to this show that I have to trust that his character arcs will take the show somewhere new and interesting.
robley
September 29, 2011 at 11:48PM EST Reply to CommentI was hoping last week's premier was an anomaly but tonight's show was even worse. Both shows felt off. The gags were broad and stunningly unfunny. The Jeff/Annie romance was uncompelling and rang false, the Britta storyline was just sort of embarrassing. I told everyone I know that the show was the best sitcom on TV the past two years, but suddenly I find myself thinking I won't make it through the rest of the season, if not the next couple of weeks. Did Dan hire all new writers?
keith A lot of new writers, yeah. The old ones quit because he wouldn't let them go home to their families. Slackers.
September 30, 2011 at 12:09AM ESTr1pvanw1nkl3 New writers or old, the whole thing pretty much rests on Dan Harmon's shoulders. If you read interviews/listen to commentaries it's pretty clear that he he doesn't let anything slip by his influence. He also writes a lot of the jokes, even though his name usually isn't on the script.
September 30, 2011 at 2:59AM ESTmaria Yeah, I thought Britta's storyline was horrible. I was embarrassed for the actress and everyone involved.
September 30, 2011 at 9:55AM ESTCommunity has always been hit and miss for me anyway, but sadly more miss than hit. I guess I don't like when it's way too over the top wacky as it often tends to be. It takes me out of the show and I find that comedic style weak and not very funny.
WeebeysPlasticFish Something felt off about the pacing or build-up for me. I didn't think they earned the moment between Jeff and Annie in this episode, and last week the speech was really forced. I hope they let the characters be a bit more natural from here on. Otherwise they just become props for the sake of the plot, like on Glee, which I couldn't help but be reminded of with this episode.
September 30, 2011 at 10:29AM ESTprettok
September 29, 2011 at 11:48PM EST Reply to CommentIs it possible you think you have forgotten the 'normal' episodes because they can't be described with a single word or a single visual image or theme. It doesn't make those episodes any less brilliant. "More memorable" does not necessarily mean better.
jcpdiesel21 I could not agree more.
September 30, 2011 at 10:07AM ESTcurbyourentropy
September 29, 2011 at 11:51PM EST Reply to CommentI've watched tonight's episode twice now and enjoyed it a lot more the second time around. While it definitely feels odd to see these more conventional episodes of a show that is so adept at being unconventional, I do think it's a bit early in the season to be worried about the state of the show (which you two basically admit in your conversation, so yeah).
(Also, I giggled so hard at "The science works out." So good.)
Steve
September 29, 2011 at 11:51PM EST Reply to CommentSome quick thoughts:
- "Mixology Certification" is probably my favorite episode that Community has ever done, although there are so many good episodes it's tough to pick just one. I hope we see another episode like "Mixology" this season.
- Tonight's episode was the first time in a long time that I laughed at every Pierce line. He's much better when he's the clueless, half-senile old white guy then when he's being cruel.
- I'm sure I'm not the only one noticing this, but I find it so strange that Britta has gone from being a sexy, relatively normal woman at the beginning of the show to just a huge nutcase that the group pretty much can function without. She was very weird tonight, though I bet Gillian Jacobs had a blast acting out all the ridiculously dumb protests.
So far so good this season IMO. It will get crazy eventually but for now I'm enjoying these good old-fashioned Greendale high-jinks.
JB I don't usually laugh at Pierce, either, but I did tonight b/c he had the only funny parts. The rest of the ep. was barely watchable.
September 30, 2011 at 12:01AM ESTRobley It's customary for characters' identities to become more defined during a series' evolution but Britta's rapidly become a caricature. Gillian may have had a blast, but I can't believe the viewing audience did as well. It makes sense she was paired with Chang, she's become as much a one-note character as he.
September 30, 2011 at 12:02AM ESTmaria The Britta storyline ruined the episode for me. I hated it and hate that she has become a ridiculous caricature.
September 30, 2011 at 9:57AM ESTJB
September 29, 2011 at 11:59PM EST Reply to CommentOk, I don't have time (nor patience) to read the entire exchange above. All I know is that tonight's ep. ranks (IMHO) as one of the WORST episodes of Community ever. This wasn't just a "low-concept" episode; it was a NO concept episode. Did the show dump all their previous writers for a new (and sub-par) crew? Seems that way to me. And unless this show gets back on track, count me out.
Baba booey There have only been two episodes! Back on track? They haven't even pulled out of the train station yet!
September 30, 2011 at 12:09AM ESTtheurbanzone i agree. i mean, if you KNOW community, people would have NOTICED IN THE FIRST 2 MINUTES that this episode is different from the previous ones. It had like, almost no plot that we could really connect with, it had REALLY lame jokes, and I mean like The Office lame, where it's OBVIOUSLY begging for audiences to laugh, the lines and tempos were lame, and the subplot with britta and chang? Good god. It was just generally a horrible episode. And the writer for this did Basic Rocket Science. That was a GREAT EPISODE, why the hell is this one so shitty? Its a shame really that a "bad episode has been added to the Community line. Luckily this week's episode, it's like they realized they REALLY fucked up, and made up for it. It was good
October 7, 2011 at 4:33AM ESTBaba booey
September 30, 2011 at 12:06AM EST Reply to CommentHonestly, you guys are my two favorite tv writers but I just don't get your conversation.
You are really going to watch 2 episodes and have this conversation? I could see maybe at the half way point, but now?
These first two episodes in my opinion were two perfectly solid episodes. Not all timers but solid, certainly nothing to have me worrief about the season.
The other thing I.don't get is the concern over certain fans liking only certain kinds of episodes. I mean it's clear the community audience is what it is. Those fans aren't leaving.
Sure people may prefer certain things in episodes, but for the most part community fans are all in, and any new episode of community will be welcomed.
It just seems like you guys are trying to start the "it's not as good as it used to be" backlash without actually saying it.
Just seems very odd after two episodes. Interesting read though. You guys should cross podcast streams at some point.
Ditko "It just seems like you guys are trying to start the "it's not as good as it used to be" backlash without actually saying it."
September 30, 2011 at 7:02AM ESTCorrect, sir.
keith
September 30, 2011 at 12:07AM EST Reply to CommentDidn't love it. The 'real' bits felt forced or fake. I love the realness usually; my most rewatched episodes are the first 4 of season 1 and AD&D from S2, but maybe they can't get back to that place any more. Harmon says this year will be dark. Personally I hope they go black, drop the comedy entirely and leave everyone feeling wrecked. That would be one viable new place they could go (before getting cancelled without giving us the S4 denouement - so that doesn't work). I have faith in them to keep blowing my mind regardless.
XK
September 30, 2011 at 12:11AM EST Reply to CommentI quite enjoyed tonight's episode. I like the normal episodes and even the sad episodes because they give some sort of grounding for the crazy shows.
At the end of the day, if it makes me laugh, it's already doing more than most of the shows on television, and at that point, I don't care so much if I'm laughing at a funny setup or at the sheer audacity of what's happening on my tv screen. Laughter is good; community delivers some of both types.
XK Really, the only parts I was not wild about in this episode were the Jeff/Annie conversation on the couch, which felt forced and a bit like fan service, and Brita's final protest, which was painful. The whole M.U.N. thing was funny, Brita's inability to kick over the trash can was great, and Pierce finally had some good lines again.
September 30, 2011 at 12:17AM ESTSD
September 30, 2011 at 12:13AM EST Reply to CommentI know I'm in a very small minority but I like it when Britta is the female lead. The Jeff/Annie plots always result in these contrived and overly sappy endings whereas the Jeff/Britta plots from season 1 felt more real and less forced.
echos myron
September 30, 2011 at 12:13AM EST Reply to CommentThis episode was so, so bad. I`d honestly give it about a D-. The writing was on the level of Whitney.
DC Agree. I was cringing so much that by the time Annie saw the UN flyer, I had to change the channel. So trite and sterotypical to have the Asian know-it-all (I'm Asian, so it particularly annoyed me). I didn't watch the rest of it, but I'll continue to tune in. You don't have to win every game to have a winning season.
September 30, 2011 at 11:13AM ESTblahblah Is it trite and stereotypical to have a non-Asian know-it-all, because the point was that the character was just like Annie (who's not Asian). It wasn't just a random Asian stereotype character. What does it matter what race the character was?
September 30, 2011 at 8:58PM ESTMario
September 30, 2011 at 12:14AM EST Reply to CommentTo answer a question that's been asked twice now, Dan Harmon DID actually hire lots of new writers. The majority of his staff from last year left. I think that has a lot to do with how hard he pushes his writers to often times stay at the office all night and into the morning working on scripts.
robley Hadn't heard that. Dan Harmon seems like an incredibly smart guy, and it's clear to me after having heard his nasal drone on the DVD commentaries and WTF Podcast that his smarts are matched by his caring for the show ... but he needs to pull a Michael at Staples and ask if those Dwights will come back. So to speak. Hey, Shirley was in that episode. I forget my point.
September 30, 2011 at 12:44AM ESTLee
September 30, 2011 at 12:15AM EST Reply to CommentEvery time "Hello" started playing, I kept waiting for Jerry Seinfeld to pop in saying, "Helllllllooooooo. La la la!"
Not a great episode, but it got extra points from me for having Martin Starr in it.
Connor Considering how much of a Freaks & Geeks fan Sepinwall is, can't believe Starr couldn't get a shoutout.
September 30, 2011 at 2:03AM ESTRory I've been waiting to watch this. It took me 8 seconds to spot the voice. I paused it, came online and decided that I needed to express my Straight Hetero love for Martin Starr
September 30, 2011 at 3:07PM ESTLee Hopefully, this won't be the last we see of Professor Cligoris.
September 30, 2011 at 3:26PM ESTOwen
September 30, 2011 at 12:26AM EST Reply to CommentI love Community, I've been watching from the first episode, and my favorite episode is Physical Education from season one.
So basically my opinion is 180 degrees from Alan and Todd's.
The high-concept episodes are great, but for me an episode gets extra points if it's grounded in the community college setting.
I liked this episode quite a bit and especially liked the Britta/Chang storyline. I laughed out loud at Britta kicking the trashcan, and I never, ever laugh out loud at comedies. But judging from the comments so far, it sounds like mine is the minority opinion.
Metty No, I think ýou have the majority opinion. Alan & Todd are freaking out over nothing. The show is still enjoyable and we're only 44 minutes into the season. Calm down guys!!!
September 30, 2011 at 12:36AM EST
Yeah, I kind of think this whole conversation is like if, at the end of Ratatouille, instead of just savoring the simplicity of his favorite childhood food, the critic immediately began weighing his nostalgia for good ole' ratatouille against the more exciting dishes he'd been enjoying for years.
September 30, 2011 at 1:03AM EST(And Troy being excited at the mention of Boutros Boutros-Ghali was pure gold.)
Danielle I agree with the comments on "grounded" episodes. While I have enjoyed lots many of the wackier eps, my all-time favorite 30 secomds of this show is the Latvian Independence Day parade - made even better when I learned that the original air date was actually the holiday.
September 30, 2011 at 2:48AM ESTI love the hijinks where characters interact with each other as their own neutotic selves, because I can then 'get' the high concept stories where everyone plays a more extreme version. Without the foundation, the high-concept eps just become spectacle instead of part of the canon.
Lissette Totally agree! I really enjoyed this episode. My favorite Community eps are ones like 'Debate 101.'
September 30, 2011 at 3:20PM ESTThe best part of Community is when we just get to explore the characters' problems. And this episode was all about core needs/ dysfunctions in Jeff (his mixed feeling about his attraction to Annie), Annie (perfectionism), Chang (need for power and authority) and Britta (need to get attention for being a different).
If you love the Community characters, I don't see how you can't like this episode.
September 30, 2011 at 12:34AM EST Reply to CommentThe thing about trying to please the fans is, well,
Fans can never be pleased. Don't even try.
Artemis
September 30, 2011 at 12:36AM EST Reply to CommentGreat interview. It's so nice to see two of my favourite television writers talking about a show we all love.
Hannah Lee
September 30, 2011 at 12:41AM EST Reply to CommentFor me, it's not a question of normal vs. abnormal. It's a question of whether the the episode is funny and enjoyable to watch. And tonight's episode fell down a bit on the funny.
There were moments, but too often it felt like it was trying too hard to be odd. And 2 episodes in, I've pretty much had my S3 fill of references to Jeff and Annie's "relationship", whatever form it might take. It was pretty heavy handed this episode dragged the episode to a halt for me. (I feel like Harmon and Co would be better served to have webisodes focused on the Jeff/Annie stuff, so fanfolk can stream them again and again, and the rest of us can just get on with watching the whole ensemble) Plus, the "Britta, the needlessly defiant and relentlessly unsuccessful" bit is wearing more than a little thin.
I'll still be tuning in, but hoping more for the quirky, hysterically funny show about an oddball group of classmates.
AL "...it's not a question of normal vs. abnormal. It's a question of whether the the episode is funny and enjoyable to watch."
September 30, 2011 at 12:12PM ESTThe more people realize this, the better off the show will be.
Roy
September 30, 2011 at 12:42AM EST Reply to CommentThe show is kind of stumbling out of the gate for me this season, but it's still early. They can turn it around.
Sully
September 30, 2011 at 12:47AM EST Reply to CommentDid anyone notice that when Britta was protesting in the dog cage or whatever a really hot blonde girl walked by holding hands by a skinny nerdy looking kid who would never ever get her in real life? I wonder if that was supposed to be a subtle joke or if they just put 2 extras together randomly. Either way I need to get a life
Cody
September 30, 2011 at 12:53AM EST Reply to CommentUpon watching the episode, I found the slight broadness of Annie and, specifically, Britta was a little odd, but on deeper thought, it seems to fit the theme set up last week for the season. Much like Jeff's persistence to appear laidback & cool led to him attacking the study table with an axe and appearing crazy to the rest of the group, Britta's persistence to remain anti-establishment & Annie's persistence to be the perfect student led to them appearing crazy to others(Britta locking herself in a cage and covering her body in dolls, Annie throwing a temper tantrum on the table). Basically, the character's stubborn refusal to change is leading to them reaching new lows & looking childish or downright insane to others.
Dan Harmon has said in interviews he studied THE WIRE before this season to come up with a very specific, character-based structure. I'm thinking that these first few episodes are just the slow build-up, establishing the character's problems they have to overcome by the end of the year, which they will slowly work on throughout Season 3.
Though perhaps I'm overthinking this way too much.
Also, interesting to note with all the talk of "Mixology Certification" that tonight's episode was written by the same writer, Andy Bobrow.
Luke
September 30, 2011 at 12:55AM EST Reply to CommentTonight was the weirdest episode of Community I've yet seen. I thought the first two episodes of season 3 seemed so much different in tone and style than anything the series has done so far, that there must be a larger game being played here. They were too far off for it to be on accident...at least, that's what I want to believe. Would Dan Harmon pull a "Newhart" and have a whole season be a dream? I think he would....
CCK
September 30, 2011 at 1:03AM EST Reply to CommentMy wife knows I love this show. She's sat through a couple of episodes before, usually joining in while I'm already watching it. She watched My Dinner With Abed, I know that. Anyway, she was Omar last week so when I went to watch this week's episode, she made me wait until she could watch it with me. Towards the end she looked at me and said "do you ever actually laugh at this show." That is not a good sign if they were hoping to get new people to watch it and like it
The Britta storyline was terrible, but I did like the use of Hello and the groups reaction when she was tased. The Jeff-Annie stuff just seemed weird and out of nowhere. It was like "hey Jeff has to hook up with someone and we just did Jeff and Britta again, so it is Annie's turn again." I don't mind them hooking up, but the byplay tonight did seem creepy.
nath
September 30, 2011 at 1:15AM EST Reply to CommentI don't think the problems with this episode had anything to do with it being lower-concept. I think the problems were
-the Britta-Chang plotline was very one-note
-drawing attention to the (alleged) creepiness of the Jeff-Annie thing makes it much creepier
-episode seemed to re-hash a lot of the basics from "Debate 109"
Joe
September 30, 2011 at 1:18AM EST Reply to CommentThis seems a bit overblown. Community feels as strong through two (TWO!) episodes this season as it did last. I laughed more at this tonight than Parks, so I guess I'm missing something.
I sometimes wonder if I'm a teevee elitist as I sit stone-faced, bored to tears during Whitney, but the sort of debate as to whether Community should be high concept or a sentimental Cougar Town gang-esque sitcom strikes me as totally unnecessary. Even so far this season, Community strikes me as an ambitious sitcom. It tries to have sophisticated storytelling (for a sitcom) and creative plotting, and so far, it's hit far more than it's missed.
It just strikes me as absurd for Todd to say something like how he'll remember the space shuttle episode more than this one, which made him laugh more. C'mon, that's taking the art of television criticism to a level where Community is damned if it does, damned if it doesn't.
nath
September 30, 2011 at 1:19AM EST Reply to Comment"How do they let the characters grow up without altering the chemistry of what worked?"
They can't. That's why college is only four years. People help each other grow up, and then when the time comes they all spread their wings and fly.
Kel
September 30, 2011 at 1:23AM EST Reply to CommentThe question is not if the episode suffered because it wasn't wacky or "normal", or if it was high-concept for low-concept. The episode, much like last week's episode, suffered because it just wasn't funny.
I loved the first two seasons of Community, both the off-the-wall episodes like Paintball and the Zombie episodes, and the "traditional" sitcom episodes about school life and relationships. Regardless of what category they fell into, the first two seasons' episodes all had great writing, hilarious one-liners, and just a great flow where everything fit in well. These first two episodes of season 3 lacked that. Tonight's episode had no hilarious moment or line. The Brita character seemed loud and silly, various character lines seemed forced, Chang finally crossed the line from outrageous to irritating, and the whole model UN plot left me wondering who thought that this would be worth devoting a huge chunk of the episode to.
The episode lacked the sharp wit and intelligence that previous episodes all had. Regardless of what kind of episode we watched the past seasons, every episode had that "feel" of a Community episode. These two season 3 episodes just didn't feel like Community. Does the show have new writers or something? It's as if some new people who don't know the characters skimmed some CliffNotes of the show, thought "oh, this is what this character is like" and wrote down what they think this character is supposed to say or do.
I hope we are just experiencing a slow start to this season, and not witnessing a collapse like How I Met Your Mother underwent the last couple years.
Tammy
September 30, 2011 at 1:26AM EST Reply to CommentA lot of creepy sexual subtext throughout this episode. I recommend watching the episode again with an eye for it. It becomes bizarrely interesting in an entirely different way.
Lee Harvey
September 30, 2011 at 1:30AM EST Reply to CommentCan we please retire 'IMO' and 'IMHO?' So tiresome. Besides, everything you say is an opinion.
The first 2 episodes have been fairly weak. Let's not panic just yet.
Hatfield I disagree on the episodes being weak, but let me throw you a big ol' THIS to your other point. If the turn of phrase is so inconsequential it can be chopped down to an acronym, I'm thinking you can probably just drop it altogether.
September 30, 2011 at 1:54AM ESTHatfield
September 30, 2011 at 1:51AM EST Reply to CommentI feel like you guys are so caught up in comparing this type of episode to that type of episode that you missed a lot of what made this one funny (or at least forgot to mention it). And I get that part of the discussion is how your preference of the higher concept episodes can make you reflexively downgrade something like this. But I thought this was a brilliant episode for Alison Brie (I really liked her playing with the straw and Troy taking the cup from her and giving it back, sans lid, with her never stopping the motion), managed to use Chang pretty well, took some great cheapshots at the UN, and even made fart humor seem relatively fresh. Different strokes, I know, but I laughed so much I just assumed there would be a more positive general reaction.
saluk I agree. Did these people see the same episode I did? I think I laughed harder and more often in this episode than with most of the episodes last season, although I agree some of them may have been more memorable. The Britta-Chang thing was very interesting, with britta meeting a need of Chang's, and Chang providing a need of Britta's, it was almost like some mixed-up romance. I'm interested to see if they take that any further in the coming episodes.
September 30, 2011 at 5:13PM ESTI'm still farting.
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