Recap: 'Fringe' - 'Subject 9'
Tonight's hour features a major breakthrough that produces even more questions
Anna Torv of "Fringe"
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On last night’s “Community,” the show enacted several different timelines that played out based on a single roll of a die during a group game of Yahztee. I’m not as big as fan of the show as some people at HitFix, but I did appreciate how the show succinctly demonstrated how the removal of one person from the group brought out interesting sides of the others that remained. What works for twenty-one minutes, however, doesn’t always work over a much longer time period. We’re now four episodes into whatever roll of the die “Fringe” has currently cast, and the final moments of tonight’s episode doesn’t mean that we’re any closer to figuring out what Yahtzee reality we’re currently in.
So, first thing’s first: Peter Bishop’s back, and he’s gonna save the show’s reputation. (Hey ha, hey na, my Peter’s back!) Am I psyched? Mostly. As I’ve stated since the beginning of the season, the success of all the time spent in a Peter-less world would ultimately be judged based on the final outcome of this narrative choice. And even with Peter back, it’s clear that this arc hasn’t ended. It could end in one episode, two episodes, twelve…it’s unclear at this point. So I’m not ready to judge these first four hours as a whole yet, even though the younger Bishop crashed back to Earth by skinny dipping in Reiden Lake.
I’m not ready because it’s still unclear what, if anything, will reset now that he has returned. Him snapping back to “reality” forces me to put that word in quotes. I’m not doing it to be cute or to add emphasis. I’m doing it because I’m not sure how we’re supposed to view the world we’re seeing. That’s fascinating from a theoretical perspective, but often maddening from a practical one. I’m sure I wasn’t alone in thinking that Peter’s return would erase the timeline created upon his disappearance at the end of Season 3. But that isn’t the case…at least yet. It’s still in play, however. So just like Peter hovered between existence and oblivion, I’m hovering between being fully on board with the show and treating it the way Walter Bishop treats hotel rooms.
All of this is a shame, since Anna Torv and John Noble once again brought their respective A games tonight. A large part of “Subject 9” was a chamber piece, designed to put the two of them alone and watch what Peter’s absence had done to them. Were this an irrevocable, Peter-less New World Order, we as the audience could ache for the losses they could feel but not fully comprehend. But Peter’s Blue Energy Cloud perpetually reminded us of how fragile, how reversible, and potentially how immoral this order might be.
I would prefer that the reality that existed before Peter entered the Doomsday Machine be the “correct” version, because that contains the people I’ve watched for three seasons. But I could be ultimately swayed by a show that had the nerve to unmake that in order to produce a new reality. (And several of you have pointed out over the last few weeks that, technically, what we’ve seen this season shows the way things were always supposed to play out. Although that assumes that September’s actions on Reiden Lake in 1985 were not part of the correct time stream. Ugh. I have a Yahtzee-induced headache. ) However, “Fringe” currently plays out in a nebulous world that is teasing every possibility without committing to any of them. This may very well all have a fantastic payoff down the road, and I’m 100% rooting for it to do so. But that’s making the here and now very difficult.
What makes it difficult is that when I should be admiring Olivia and Walter sharing their first root beer float, I’m thinking a multitude of thoughts that remove me from the emotional immediacy of the scene. Some of those thoughts: “Has Olivia not met any other fellow patients from Jacksonville in this reality?”, “Why the hell does Nina Sharp know so much about Olivia’s teenage dating life?”, and most importantly, “Will these emotional scenes be wiped off the map once things are ‘fixed’ through Peter’s return?” Chadwick Boseman played the hell out of former cortexiphan subject Mark Little, but the shadows of Nick Lane and all of Olivia’s other childhood compatriots loomed as large as Peter’s has over this entire season. Little’s backstory is heartbreaking, but also serves primarily as a metaphor for Peter’s liminality: he’s neither a normal person nor a full-on superpowered freak. Just as Peter was neither alive nor dead. Just as reality itself has neither been completely set or completely rewritten.
Options are great to have in a storyteller’s back pocket. That we can discuss the multitude of ways in which this story can unspool is thrilling for many “Fringe” fans, for sure. But I long for the days in which the unspooling took place in one fixed reality that already had a limitless set of possibilities. What I loved about “Fringe” was the ease with which I could try and hook people in: “Two worlds. One door. WHO YA GOT?” That was approximately 108 times easier than trying to sell someone on “Lost.” But now, I’m watching a show in which largely unknown, nearly inscrutable puppet masters (The Observers) have played God(s) with our beloved characters, their lives, their memories, and their realities. That’s far more complex, and quite frankly, more than a little less interesting.
That the persistence of emotional memory is bringing Peter back represents a very “Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind” thing for the show to do. It suggests that the show views the reality on display as somehow “wrong.” But while the two universes can be connected by an interdimensional bridge, how can two realities also be connected? How can Olivia have never met Peter, yet always have met Peter? How does “Fringe” fuse the characters from before his trip fifteen years in the future and the ones that arose afterwards? Will they even try to do so? And will any of them scream “YAHTZEE!” at any point? (And while I’m throwing out questions to you all: have we ever discovered who let the dogs out, or how to solve a problem like Maria?)
The good news, hopefully, is that with Peter now back in the show, speculation will give way to actual answers, and we’ll know once and for all what the true stakes of this fourth season truly are. My hope is that we’ll look back on these first four episodes as a necessary arc to get us into the real narrative meat of this year. The show works best when it gives us moments with characters we care about. Right now? I’m sadly unsure about who these people truly are. So while I admire the talent on display, I’m admiring it from a slightly removed distance. And for a show that has long sucked me in more than just about any show on television, that’s a horrible place to be. Like Peter, I’ve been on the outside looking in. Now that he’s back, I hope I am right behind him.
A few more thoughts on tonight’s episode…
*** Last year, we saw an attack at 6:02 a.m. Tonight, we saw Peter’s first “appearance” at 5:59 a.m. The lesson? It doesn’t pay to be a morning person in “Fringe”.
*** The subplot about Walter’s potential remanding to St. Claire’s may have provided him a reason to leave the lab, but certainly didn’t produce any true tension. What were the odds of sending Walter back there? Zero.
*** When I first saw Walter’s set-up for the peanut photography experiment, I scribbled down, “‘Matrix’ rip-off.” So I was delighted when Astrid mentioned he got the inspiration from that movie. Now, I want Walter to re-enact at least one experiment from a sci-fi film in every episode of “Fringe” from this moment on. C’mon: he can totally send a DeLorean back in time using the power of lightning!
*** Speaking of Astrid: “Claire? Really? That doesn’t even start with an A.” That, plus Mark’s irrational fear of raisin toast, made me laugh more than a little.
*** The fake out with Mark Little’s ability not causing the blue electrical anomaly was totally predictable, but I’m going to give the show a pass and assume we’ll learn Peter took this form in order to connect Olivia with the one person who could dislodge him from his personal purgatory. Or something. That’s much easier to swallow than the show not having a better way to initiate Peter’s plunge into the lake.
*** I really want to know whose name is below Broyles’ on the masthead Olivia produced, and why it scared the local police officer so much. But only if this reality sticks. Also, why is Olivia a freakin’ cat burglar now? Wait, darnit, I am so not getting sucked down this rabbit hole…ending the bullets now…
What did you think of tonight’s episode? Happy to have Peter back, or are you more perplexed than ever? Did this show’s emotional moments work for you, or are you hedging your bets until we see where this all goes? And will you be able to wait two whole weeks to find out? Sound off below!
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Login or create a HitFix account Login SignupAngie
October 14, 2011 at 11:51PM EST Reply to CommentThe 'Claire' was a reference to Jasika Nicole's partner on #Fringe.
Devin
October 15, 2011 at 12:01AM EST Reply to Comment"Also, why is Olivia a freakin’ cat burglar now?"
Olivia's had lockpicking equipment as far back as the end of season 1. :p
Rachel In addition, I believe the introduction of Olivia's lockpicking skills was witnessed by the other Bishop, Peter, who reacted similarly to Walter with a sort of "you can do that?" incredulity, mixed of course with a soupcon of "that's hot."
October 17, 2011 at 9:44PM ESTToo Late Kev
October 15, 2011 at 12:07AM EST Reply to CommentBelow Broyle's name, I thought it might have said "blanket authority" instead of an actual name.
I thought it was a really good episode. Can't wait for the next one, but I apparently have to wait two weeks!
Teproc I though it was the name of the Head of the FBI or simply of the President of the US. It would make sense, since Fringe is supposed to be super secret. Kind of weird that we haven't seen the President in the first seasons now that I think of it.
October 15, 2011 at 8:36AM ESTmikejones
October 15, 2011 at 12:12AM EST Reply to CommentI can't read your recaps anymore because I really don't think you even like this show
Tausif Khan Why does a recapper or reviewer need to like a show? Critically what is gained by having a recapper/reviewer like the show that they review?
October 15, 2011 at 1:14AM ESTFor me reading a recap helps me to understand the place of the episode within the series structure. Whether the characters stories are coherent. Whether the acting resonates and brings out the promise of well written words or brings an interpretation to the material that rises above poor writing. I read reviews to understand how the show works, what the people who made the episode were trying to communicate and whether their attempt worked or not. Different people have different opinions about what constitutes the criteria to answer these questions but understanding how shows were will give people a better appreciation of the process of writing developing story with resonant thematic elements as well as a better understanding of how to communicate and understand a complex and long developing message from the creators of the television show to us the viewer. Hopefully this will help to illuminate something about how we live our lives.
I don't need a recapper/reviewer to be a diehard few point out how the show is great at every turn it doesn't help to create the best environment for critical thinking.
Tausif Khan *...diehard fan pointing out how the show is great at every turn. It doesn't...
October 15, 2011 at 1:16AM EST
First Ryan loves Fringe so I have to say your comment is pretty off-base.
October 15, 2011 at 2:06AM ESTBut I do think that at this point there's really no point in asterisking every recap with "if this reality holds". Given that there wasn't a magic reset to exactly as before in the season premiere we can assume that the reality is here to stay.
John
October 15, 2011 at 12:18AM EST Reply to CommentThis was a damn good episode, possibly the best in nearly a year. Yes, I'm still skeptical, but when a show delivers the goods it's just best to chill and wait for the outcome, then criticize. This review seems like a critique of future episodes and not the one that aired tonight.
svetlana I completely agree with your comment. This is the first episode in a long time that didn't confuse the hell out of me. I normally hate sci fi anything, so I'm sure I don't look as deep into it as most other fans. Tonight episode was so clear and simple and well done that it makes me wish all of them could be like this.
October 15, 2011 at 7:41AM ESTJackson
October 15, 2011 at 12:33AM EST Reply to CommentHilarious. Any constructive criticism is perceived as hate for the show. This is what happens when the audience becomes so small. Only the unflinching hardcore remain. Wait for it...you know who's "Fringe can do no wrong" post is pending.
John The only problem I had with the the review is that it really wasn't a review of the episode. It was a review of the overall arc.
October 15, 2011 at 1:19AM ESTGreg
October 15, 2011 at 12:34AM EST Reply to CommentI assumed the name below Broyles was the President.
Was that a call out to The Wire and Lance Reddick with Lt. Daniels?
S I assumed the same thing about the name.
October 15, 2011 at 1:39AM ESTjohn Ilg
October 15, 2011 at 12:52AM EST Reply to CommentI HAVE WATCHED EVERY EPISODE OF FRINGE . ALTHOUGH I CANNOT COUNT ON 1 HAND HOW MANY TIMES THE SHOW HAD DISAPPOINTED ME IN THE PAST . THIS SEASONS FIRST FEW EPISODES WERE EHHH OK AT BEST , NO OFFENSE OLIVA , AND WALTER. PETER BEING IN THE SHOW GAVE A LOT MORE CHARACTER TO OLIVE AND WALTER . HE HELPS TO DESIGN WHO THEY ARE AND WITHOUT HIM THEY ARE VERY DIFFERENT , WITH THAT SAID I BELIEVE THAT THE PRODUCERS WERE NOT TRING TO DO ANYTHING BUT KEEP US WATCHING , THEY KNEW ALL ALONG THAT PETER COULD NOT BE TAKEN OUT OF THE SHOW, SO TO KEEP US WATCHING THEY DROPPED SUTTLE HINTS THATS HE WAS THERE ALL ALONG. NOW TONIGHTS SHOW SUPRISED ME I REALLY THOUGHT THEY WOULD HAVE ENDED IT WITH HIM APPEARING IN THE LAKE , BUT THEY TOOK IT A LITTLE BIT FURTHER AND NOW THE SHOW HAS TAKEN A TURN , I AM MORE EXCITED ABOUT NEXT WEEKS SHOW THAN I HAVE BEEN ABOUT ANY OF THEM
Tausif Khan
October 15, 2011 at 1:02AM EST Reply to CommentThis is the best episode I have seen this fall 2011 season. It didn't do anything gimmick-y and allowed us to focus on the stories of the main characters.
It focused on two characters I cared about. The actors performances were interesting. However, it featured tiny bits of new information about the characters we did not know about long running threads in their character back story. Walter wasn't just his lovable old man crazy self but was dark in his anger and his rage against the hotel room. Olivia ended up questioning her paternal relationship with Walter testing their relationship and planting a seed of doubt once again of whether we should care for Walter and trust him. This show dealt with so much of the emotional impact of the character back story and tension that the science fiction mythos was an added bonus.
I especially loved that they had Walter offer two important explanations of the phenomenon (concurrent with one another) and there wasn't a big debate about the science behind what was going on. (It was like Brannon Braga was no were near that room! Not even affiliated with the Fox network!) This allowed the writers to focus on the tensions between the characters and remind us why we love these characters and why it is still tough to care for these characters.
Tausif Khan
October 15, 2011 at 1:04AM EST Reply to CommentAstrid and Broyles need more story lines of their own.
If Peter died why did Walter do the cortexiphan trials? What was his driving motivation to do the trials? It needs to be more than a desire for greatness the new reason needs to be equally personal and compelling.
OldDarth That reason likely has not changed. Bell & Bishop were preparing for what they believed to be an assault led by Walternate. The only thing that I believe has changed is that instead of Walternate's motive being to retrieve his son this time it is for revenge for Peter's drowning.
October 15, 2011 at 1:22AM ESTTausif Khan Walter Bishop's motivations to do the original cortexiphan trials was to find a way to get Walternate's Peter back to his own world. He was filled with guilt for stealing Peter. This is what drove Walter and made the scientific endeavor interesting. Now there is no reason for Walter to do the trials. Why would be build up an army of children to fight a technologically superior alternate world?
October 15, 2011 at 1:32AM EST
The cortexiphan drug trial predate Peter's taking, and presumably the original purpose of the trials were to harness of the power of the children.
October 15, 2011 at 1:47AM ESTOldDarth As the other poster mentioned the trials predated Peter's taking and the intent shifted of the trials, at least for Walter. Bell's reasons were different.
October 15, 2011 at 2:05AM ESTTausif Khan All right I am going to take a specific tack in responding to this.
October 15, 2011 at 2:52AM ESTIn terms of when things happened you are probably correct because I had doubts I was writing about when I wrote it.
However, as Old Darth points out getting Peter back eventually became the driving force as we saw in the flash back episode last season. For me that makes it a story worth telling the television show because it is a pivotal moment for the characters and helps to explain the science behind what is going. If there is no emotional drive there is no need to tell that story. We are not going to see every experiment has done in his past. We will only see the ones that are necessary to advance the plot and the characters individual struggles.
Therefore for me the question remains the same. What is the emotional drive that makes Walter want to pursue the cortexiphan trials in this "Amber" verse? Why would he be raising an army of children to fight a technologically superior alternate world? This makes no sense.
Tausif Khan *I had doubts about what I was writing...
October 15, 2011 at 2:55AM EST*For me that makes it a story worth telling on the television show...
* We are not going to see every experiment Walter has done...
Teproc First off, the change in this world happens when Peter was saved by September : here he wasn't. So Walter still went to the Redverse and stole Peter.
October 15, 2011 at 8:45AM ESTNot sure what bothers you here. The emotional drive is no different : Peter still got stolen from him : the fact that he actually died doesn't matter, since Walternate doesn't know that.
Tausif Khan The focus is not on Walternate it is on Walter.
October 15, 2011 at 3:22PM ESTWalter became focused on the cortexiphan trials because he wanted to get Peter back to his universe. With Peter dead he has no reason to be so enthusiastic about the trials. If there is no drive to do the trials why tell the story on telelvision?
intangible fancy ...because Walter started them well before our Peter died/didn't die (the point of divergence in the timelines), and Olivia is still Cortexiphan Kid? The misuse of science is a major theme in the show, and the Cortexiphan trials are one of the major examples or that.
October 16, 2011 at 3:19AM ESTTausif Khan
October 15, 2011 at 1:27AM EST Reply to Comment"Little’s backstory is heartbreaking, but also serves primarily as a metaphor for Peter’s liminality: he’s neither a normal person nor a full-on superpowered freak."
Every time you say a variation of liminal a McNutt gets their wings. True story.
Tausif Khan
October 15, 2011 at 1:38AM EST Reply to CommentRyan I am really curious about this:
"What makes it difficult is that when I should be admiring Olivia and Walter sharing their first root beer float, I’m thinking a multitude of thoughts that remove me from the emotional immediacy of the scene. Some of those thoughts: “Has Olivia not met any other fellow patients from Jacksonville in this reality?”, “Why the hell does Nina Sharp know so much about Olivia’s teenage dating life?”, and most importantly, “Will these emotional scenes be wiped off the map once things are ‘fixed’ through Peter’s return?”"
You say that we started to think these thoughts on your own. There was nothing in the scene that compelled you to pull away from the scene and yet you chose to. Why were you not compelled enough by the character interaction of Walter and Olivia and their emotional journey more dark and grounded than the original version to keep yourself from this line of thinking.
We learned from the John Pyper-Ferguson episode that even though someone maybe absent what they teach us will remain. So if there is a change in this time line what we learned in these early episodes will not change. So I forgot about Peter and logical machinations, listened for plausible explanations and then looked for good character interaction, new character information and a struggle through previous pain in character story lines. That made me compelled to watch these episodes.
Teproc Also, the Nina Sharpe thing is pretty obvious to me : she raised Olivia after she killed her father, because Walter and Bell felt responsible for it, and her.
October 15, 2011 at 8:46AM ESTOldDarth
October 15, 2011 at 1:59AM EST Reply to CommentGreat episode tonight!
And the promo for the next episode - 0-0! Me want now!
Anyone else feel the show dropped the hand holding mode with this episode and kicked the show into the next gear?
Thank you Fringe show runners for not taking the easy way out and collapsing one of the timelines upon Peter's return.
Was a little disappointed though that the show went back to using a Cortexiphan Kid to bring Peter back. They have become the R2D2s or Sonic Screwdrivers of Fringe. Was really hoping September would have modified his 'Peter Eraser' from blow to vacuum and help Peter cross over.
Totally digging what is happening in this timeline because my money remains on this one counting just as much as the previous seasons.
S4 will end up being merged with the previous season's events.
And how else could the show have those great Olivia and Walter moments without the current story line setup? Loved the Olivia and Walter moments tonight - hotel room & rootbeer floats.
Speccing that the events in S4, via the Translucent Shape Shifters and the Big Bad behind them plus the new relationship dynamics in Season 4 will be needed with the history of the previous seasons to thwart the Season 4 threat and solve the impending dual universe collapse.
Based on the pace this season, plus the way Season 3 broke down, looking for the timelines to merge in episode 8 with the remainder of the season shifting focus to face the Big Bad and address the upcoming collapse on both sides.
At the least, Peter and Olivia will have to work in tandem to merge the two timelines.
And the journey for Olivia, Walter, Astrid et al to get to that point of trust with Peter to attempt the timeline merge should be gripping stuff.
Of course, it is just a theory. ;-)
Teproc As for the Cortexiphan kids being the Sonic Screwdrivers of this show (for those out there that don't watch Doctor Who : first off, you should, and the sonic screwdriver can basically do anything, provided the writers need it to, because of the theory of narrative causality), the Observers kind of have that role as well, so having September do it wouldn't change the problem.
October 15, 2011 at 8:50AM ESTOldDarth Point taken TeProc about the Observers but my intent with stating that September should have been the story device to bring Peter back was to actively tie the Observers to this season's story arc. With very rare exceptions such as the 'August' episode and 'Peter' the Observers have been kept passive.
October 15, 2011 at 10:28AM ESTIt would also make them less the inscrutable Puppet Masters as Ryan has noted on several occasions. Also a story action carried out by an Observer carries more dramatic weight because we know they are in for the long haul whereas the Cortexiphan Kids wear variable shades of RedShirt.
One of the possible other purposes of Peter's erasure, beyond his impact on the main cast, could be to put a face to all the manipulations the Observers have impassively carried out.
As to what the Observers are all about, highly recommend to everyone they read Arthur C. Clarke's - Childhood's End. The Observers's story seems to be a variation of that one.
Robinson OldDarth- you're surprised the Observers are "passive"? How do you think they got their name? :-)
October 16, 2011 at 6:08PM ESTI agree with Teproc- the Observers would be much more of a sonic screwdriver than the Cortexiphan kids are. The Cortexiphan kids were originally introduced specifically as an army against the alternate universe, so it is hardly surprising that they are often useful (indeed, it would have been a disappointment if they weren't.).
The reason the sonic screwdriver is a cheat is that all it does is buzz and solve a problem, rather than solve it through the actions of characters in a logical extension of the plot. The Cortexikids are characters themselves, and ones that usually have paid a sacrifice for their powers, so that makes their use of the powers bittersweet, and ties in to Walter's guilt over his history of sins. (This week was a particularly strong example dramatically).
OldDarth Surprised? Nope. Ready for the show to tie the Observers more ACTIVELY into the storyline? Absolutely.
October 17, 2011 at 11:15AM ESTSurprised? Nope. Ready for the show to tie the Observers more ACTIVELY into the storyline? Absolutely.
Your point about the CKs is absolutely spot on. My point is we get that already. 3 seasons worth of that. Now the CKs have been marginalized because of the constant re-use of the Walter guilt story point. Now the CKs only serve sonic screwdriver functions.
The Observers need to go in the other direction and move away from being story devices and become part of the story.
And remember, 'Observers,' is what we ie Broyles has called them. It is not the name they ever gave to themselves.
Jonny
October 15, 2011 at 3:52AM EST Reply to CommentI like the comment about the only people mostly left are the ones who will defend Fringe to the ends of the earth...so true.
I look at community and what they did in their last episode and it is so much better than what Fringe has managed to do in 4 episodes and probably more! What is the difference between the two? Community actually showed you differences and similarities within the actual characters and how the one small event of the die changed everything...Fringe what do they do? on the nose dialogue that is as clunky as the shows arcs and themed episodes that just said we are making this up as we go along and we have no ideas and no respect for the audience..it was delay and delay and dealay and all the episodes did was shout at the top of their lungs...WHERE IS PETER! What is the point?
How does this shape the series going forward? As Ryan said it is very difficult to understand the purpose of the narrative since everything is up for interpretation, I mean the producers do not want to say it but in truth everything before season 4 can now be seen as a lie, it never existed as we were led to believe.
How can it exist if Peter was not around? So they back peddle and back peddle trying to insert bits of information that show the characters are the same but different but it does not feel spectacular or hold true? The Cortexaphan trials are a prime example...the history of those are murky at best. First it was to fight a war against the other side, but why would there be a war Walter never stole Peter? So what is the solution? it was all William Bell, William Bell is responsible for everything the show does not want to explain and the answers die with him. It is like why was Eve shaw killed on CHUCK? never knew because the only person to know was the director of the CIA who died. So what was the point of the arc..if we never found out the truth or the producers are too chicken to actually throw out an answer and instead take shortcuts that insult the audience.
This is going to end badly, I just feel it, Chuck went down hill mythology wise in season 4 and so will Fringe...the markings are already there, sadly!
Elena Walter did steal Peter, he drowned in the lake upon their return. They told us this last week or the week before.
October 15, 2011 at 11:34AM ESTDan "Delay and delay and delay"? It was less than four episodes before Peter returned. My complaint (if I had one) was that it might've been rushed... I would've much rather had the viewer spend at least one entire episode wondering about Walter's hallucinations (whether he is truly insane in this reality) before we found out that it was actually Peter. But that was merely a mild critique rather than the outright disgust that I've seen in these comment forums so far this season. It was four chapters of a twenty-two chapter novel, for goodness sake.
October 17, 2011 at 4:53PM ESTSorry, I just don't get the complaints. I'm not an avid Fringe defender (for example, I didn't care much for the future timeline in last season's finale), but I just don't see the length of Peter's absence (or even his absence at all) as being any type of problem. Now, we may look back after another 6-10 episodes and say "man that was handled poorly," but the only uncontroverted fact is that we just don't KNOW anything yet.
BTW, as Elena pointed out, the war in this reality is still due to the kidnapping. That was made extremely clear when Walter talked to the little boy (Aaron?) in ep 4.3--Walter said that he kidnapped Peter, but he drowned. IOW, September didn't pull them both out of the lake, but apparently saved only Walter. My guess is that's how they were able to "erase" Peter from their reality... by simply changing September's previous actions.
Amrit
October 15, 2011 at 4:09AM EST Reply to CommentSince the first 4 episodes have been clunkers why could they have not started the season with the end of this episode? Peter returning straight away and seeing the show from his perspective? Oh that is right...Joshua Jackson is a guest star and you cannot give a guest star that much material and respect...got it!
Mark Have you seen the recent interview that Anna Torv did with Tvline? She says that the producers have said that this is Peters season! what a joke! It is his season yet he is not really in the first 4 episodes, so this is his season while missing nearly 20% of the seasons episodes! nice try Fringe producers, nice try...such BS. Last season was Anna Torv's season and funny thing happened...she was in every episode...Whyman and Pinkner have no respect for Joshua Jackson fans, they have no trust left since everything they say is pretty much lies.
October 15, 2011 at 6:38AM ESTTeproc Wow. Do you hate Anna Torv, or have a weird Joshua Jackson fetish ? If not, you really ought to stop calling people liars for nothing.
October 15, 2011 at 9:07AM ESTMark It is not for nothing, a lot of fans and critics (sepenwall, fienberg, mo Ryan) want a good arc for Joshua Jackson, they do not even know what is character is supposed to be....someone who knows a guy, is intelligent, is the worlds saviour or death? This season is supposed to rectify that and he is not even in it....he is basically a guest star....as a fan that us insulting to fans who invested time waiting for a solid answer.
October 15, 2011 at 10:07AM ESTOldDarth And yet everything in this season is about Peter. 4 episodes out of 22 to set that up is a small price. It is.... like reading a book.
October 15, 2011 at 10:29AM ESTMark A better price would have been to start the Season where this episode finished with him back. He has full knowledge and you would spend a lot of this season from his pov....instead we got 4 episodes of bs and exposition and only 1 good cotw. So 4 wasted episodes.
October 15, 2011 at 10:44AM EST
Then we would never ever see a Fringe division without Peter, and we would always see the new timeline as fake.
October 15, 2011 at 4:57PM ESTMark You would not need to...how everyone reacted around Peter would inform him and us of the differences...he would be our eyes in a way. Peter has all his memories of the past 3 seasons...so do we as an audience. By them telling us through a ton of exposition the differences between the characters we knew and the ones that are on the screen there is no emotional connection for us to make really. But by Peter noticing the differences as we notice them...that is more dramatically effective. Because Peter would be us..his joy would be our joy..his sadness will be our sadness...his anger will be our anger...his frustration would be our frustration...and so on and so forth. They kind of wasted 4 episodes setting up through clunky dialogue and crap CATW (except maybe episode 2) that it is really all pointless.
October 16, 2011 at 6:06AM ESTMark I can also see where Ryan is coming from because he and we still do not know how long they intend to drag this idea out for...how long does Peter have to keep sitting there telling everyone who he is and what he knows..also how long until the characters believe him and start seeing him as an important asset. If they drag this convolution out for 13 episodes or more then that is going to be extrodinarly frustrating for an audience because we would be waiting for stuff to happen that could have happened at the beginning of the season. Based on the interviews there is going to be a lot of foot dragging...the actors have said that it is going to take a long time for Peter to earn their trust and therefore become useful..so basically a lot more COTW crap...sadly.
October 16, 2011 at 6:11AM ESTBerkeley Austin Hey, Mark, how about you stop using "we" so much. Of the "we" I'm pretty cool with the way things are going. I've been enjoying the scenes non-Peter as they allow for emphasis on Walter and Olivia's relationship. 4 episodes in and they've brought Peter back. I don't mind the drama of getting where they're going. Plus some freaky stuff along the way? To the writer's I say, "Do what you gotta do."
October 19, 2011 at 10:41PM ESTMisterpuff
October 15, 2011 at 6:09AM EST Reply to CommentLiked the episode, a throwback to Coriphan Kids of The Week from the early seasons, and we got to see Walter reevaluate his life anew in this timeline, And we got Peter back. I think the rest of the season will be Peter trying to understand that bridge between worlds is not the final step of preventing the destruction of the alternate universes and he has more to do to harmonize the two universe, that and wait until Walternate finds out a grown-up Peter exists!
However, I habe a nit to pick, if you have Walter inflicting findernail stigmata upon himself and is bandaged up, you can not have him with healed hands at the ice creamery or especially where it was glaring at the power grid the next morning. Fringe is usually better than that (unless its suppose to mean something, which I doubt).
AlexD all I want to say is that this week´s kid was named Cameron James. If next´s week is not called Lucas George or Howard Ron I´ll be very disapointed.
October 18, 2011 at 5:33PM ESTjon
October 15, 2011 at 7:38AM EST Reply to CommentI can save you one Yahtzee moment. The events in September of 1985 still transpired in both time lines, the old (seasons 1-3) and the new (season 4). He explains it in an earlier season 4 episode. Peter falls through the ice and dies. This is why peter returns there. Therefore, your concerns...
"Although that assumes that September’s actions on Reiden Lake in 1985 were not part of the correct time stream. Ugh. I have a Yahtzee-induced headache,"
is unnecessary
Mike Its completely necessary...in the original timeline, September saved Peter...in the new one, he didn't....so which is ultimately the waynit was supposed to happen?
October 15, 2011 at 9:53AM ESTRobinson September is the name of the Observer who saves Peter at Reiden Lake in the original timeline, not (necessarily) the month when it happened.
October 16, 2011 at 4:26PM ESTIncidentally, while I don't recall any specification of the date that Walter crossed over, it is very unlikely that it is in September, since it was in the middle of a snowstorm on a frozen lake.
Dan Mike, perhaps it needed to happen both ways. Peter needed to survive once so that he could power the machine and repair the damage/rift caused by Walter (but they wiped him out to minimize the Observers' influence on the timeline). Then, once they deleted Peter, they still needed Walter to survive the second time around so that he could provide a balance against Walternate in the unified timeline.
October 17, 2011 at 4:58PM ESTMy theory is that the Observers erased Peter simply by having September go back to 1985 and act differently.
Elena
October 15, 2011 at 11:45AM EST Reply to CommentI liked the ep for the most part. The Walter back to hospital issue never could grip me, like you Ryan I just didn't believe it could happen, especially after Olivia and Walter discovered they were both seeing Peter last week. But I was in the moment with the ice cream shoppe and other scenes, the alternate past didn't prevent me from really enjoying and sympathizing with the current incarnations of our Fringe leads.
I'm happy they didn't reverse the timeline, at least not yet, as I said last week, I didn't like the whole "Which Olivia will he choose" and the fact that baby Henry would likely through a major wrench in Peter and our Olivia staying together. In a way the next few episodes will be like Peter's "It's A Wonderful Life"--he will see what the world would have been like had Walter not saved him, if both Peters had died. That's something none of us get to do, yet we would probably all benefit from such a chance. And I've a feeling that there will be a sense of urgency to somehow restore the timeline, or merge them, that Peter's reappearance will not be permanent unless something is done to stabilize things.
I did think it odd that the Observer just watched Peter's return, you'd think after what we saw earlier in the season, he'd either help Peter or hinder him. But maybe he's already rolled his die. He didn't blow up the remnants of Peter's existance, so he was allowing for the possibility of this reappearance.
JimTreacher
October 15, 2011 at 3:45PM EST Reply to CommentI wouldn't change a single letter of this review. That's exactly the problem I've had with this season so far. To use an example the Fringe writers would recognize, this season is like the "Flashpoint" universe that DC Comics used to transition between their old continuity and this new one. It was hard to care what happened to any of the characters, because none of it was "real." There were no consequences, because it was all going to be wiped away anyway.
It remains to be seen whether Fringe does this, or if this "amber" universe is the new normal. But I don't like it there. It's boring and it doesn't feel like any of it matters.
JimTreacher You can say that again!
October 15, 2011 at 3:46PM ESTSnakeTheCritic @ Ryan Mcgee I completely agree .
October 15, 2011 at 4:24PM ESTZ
October 15, 2011 at 5:33PM EST Reply to CommentCan someone tell me why the Observers are so intent on wiping Peter out? Does he pose a threat as an adult? It would seem the threat was eliminated when Peter chose to use the Machine to join the two universes rather than destroy one...
Dan My theory is that they wanted to minimize their own influence on the timeline. In this timeline, presumably only Walter was saved by September... perhaps to provide a balance against Walternate and keep him from destroying both realities?
October 17, 2011 at 5:01PM ESTShaun
October 15, 2011 at 9:45PM EST Reply to Comment"(Hey ha, hey na, my Peter’s back!)"
So maybe your Fringe reviews won't be so dickless now?
I'm not saying the show's always been perfect... Just that the first four episodes this season have been amazing (as was last season's finale), and I don't understand all the negativity here towards the show.
Best thing on TV now (as it's been for the past few years), and I hope it can somehow get renewed for a fifth. Enjoy it now, 'cuz you're all going to miss it when it's gone.
7s Tim
October 17, 2011 at 3:27PM EST Reply to CommentI like the show a lot, but this whole story-line has been a big dud. Actually, coming off the fantastic run they had from mid-season 2 through mid-season 3, it's been even more painful to watch the show wander into bad ideas. Once Peter had to figure out how much he loved Olivia-Prime to save the world (or whatever it was they were building towards back then), the people behind Fringe have had a goal in which I just can't become interested. They made a choice to have the effect of the Machine be Peter's removal from the timeline. They made a choice to build the latter half of season three to this event. (The emotional arc they had going at the time, with Walter having to accept that Peter would probably die, worked well, though.) I feel that the repercussions of these choices, and many subsequent ones, have not made for a better Fringe, and so I don't support them.
I still like the show and can find great enjoyment in watching the individual episodes. There is even fun in the Spot-the-Differences game in alternate reality/timeline stories. And as McGee points out, this may eventually all have been the rising action to a series climax that just blows the socks off of three versions of these characters.
I just wish I had more confidence that they could pull this off. I wish they had planned for how the show would come across to viewers, not just how it would play out on their end. I look forward to being proven wrong and being amazed and excited by this show again. I just don't believe it'll happen.
Mike
October 26, 2011 at 6:46PM EST Reply to CommentI thought 'blanket authority' meant 'Barack Obama'. (O = AU)